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Looking for John TEAL of Skipton, Yorkshire who married Frances TATHAM in Liverpool Oct, 1844 and came to Ballarat, Australia after 1851 but before 1857.

Journal by Delia

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by Delia Profile | Research | Contact | Subscribe | Block this user
on 2011-04-12 19:41:21

Delia , from Victoria, Australia, has been a Family Tree Circles member since Mar 2011. is researching the following names: TEAL, DONNELL, TATHAM and 16 other(s).

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by asheppard on 2011-04-13 00:16:56

Do you have their marriage certificate that will give you the fathers names.

I can't seem to find the TEAL/TATHAM marriage in 1844 I searched 1838-1857 and nothing appears. There are John TEAL marriages in Leeds but not to Frances and there is a Frances TATHAM marriage but not to John TEAL.

Are you sure of the details? Do you have any other information for him.
Regards Anastasia

by Delia on 2011-04-13 05:33:07

OOPS!! Sorry, Anastasia.

I meant they got married in Liverpool. Frances was born in Leeds. I cannot find their wedding in Liverpool and really wonder if they did actually marry before coming to Australia. On their daughter Janet's birth certificate, who was born in West Ballarat, it claims they married in Oct 1844 in Liverpool, which I have discovered is quite a distance from Skipton.

John's parents are not listed on his death certificate but Frances' parents are supposed to be Richard Tatham and Frances ??? according to her death cartificate.

John and Frances had two children before leaving for Australia. Elizabeth b.1846 in Yorkshire according to her death certificate, and Elijah in 1851 in Yorkshire.

I did find a John Teal 30 - stone mason, Martha Teal 40, Robert Tatham - rock labourer 20, David Tatham 18 - ?? and Frances Tatham 17 - draper living in Skipton, Yorkshire in the 1941 census and wondered if this was my family. I thought perhaps John left Martha and ran off with Frances, but perhaps Martha was his sister and the Tatham's were their boarders. I presume Robert worked with John, but who knows.

As a child growing up there was no family talk about John and Frances so I don't know if he continued his work as a stone mason in Australiabut he was listed as a stone mason on his death certificate. John and Frances were both buried in the Old Ballarat Cemetery, so they obviously settled around the area once they arrived.

by asheppard on 2011-04-14 00:32:24

There seems to be a few possibilities for this family.

I found a death for Martha Teal might be that she died and John married Frances.

Deaths Sep 1852 (>99%)
TEAL Martha Skipton 9a 2


I found this on familysearch.org could possibly be your Frances but it is Skipton not Leeds


Frances Tatham

record title: England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
name: Frances Tatham
gender: Female
baptism/christening date: 26 Oct 1823
baptism/christening place: Skipton, York, England
father's name: Elijah Tatham
mother's name: Martha
indexing project (batch) number: I03298-2
system origin: England-EASy
source film number: 919156

also found this - very interesting

John TEAL - England Marriages 1538-1973

spouse: Martha Tateham
child:
marriage: 27 Jan 1828 Skipton, York, England

record title: England Marriages, 15381973
groom's name: John Teal
bride's name: Martha Tateham
marriage date: 27 Jan 1828
marriage place: Skipton, York, England
indexing project (batch) number: I03298-3
system origin: England-EASy
source film number: 919156


Do you know who the informants on the deaths were for John and Frances?? could be another clue to the puzzle

I couldn't find any Elijah TEALs born around 1851 nor an Elizabeths TEAL but I did find this

Births Dec 1846 (>99%)
Tatham Elizabeth Skipton 23 597

Births Dec 1852 (>99%)
Tatham Elijah Skipton 9a 40

I found the Robert Tatham(from 1841 you found)and David both stayed in Skipton,Robert married Jane and David married Mary A. there is no mention of an Elijah on either family.

They are on the 1851, 1861 & 1871 Census at Skipton.

1871 Census there is also John Teal aged 63 born skipton widow stone mason Journeyman step father born Australia.


Name: Robert Tatham
Age: 50
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1821
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Jane Tatham
Gender: Male
Where born: Skipton in Craven, Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Skipton
Town: Skipton
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England
Registration district: Skipton
Sub-registration district: Skipton
ED, institution, or vessel: 10
Household schedule number: 92
Household Members:
Name Age
Robert Tatham 50 Inn keeper
Jane Tatham 44
Margt Tatham 19
Frances Tatham 13
Mary Jane Tatham 9
John Tatham 6
John Teale 63 step father widow where born Australia???
James Tatham 53 Quarry labourer
Joseph Bentley 29

The plot thickens doesn't it.

I'll keep looking
regards Anastasia

by asheppard on 2011-04-14 00:34:42

This is the 1871 for John Teal

Name: John Teale
Age: 63
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1808
Relation: Stepfather
Gender: Male
Where born: Austria [Australia]
Civil parish: Skipton
Town: Skipton
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England
Registration district: Skipton
Sub-registration district: Skipton
ED, institution, or vessel: 10
Household schedule number: 92
Household Members:
Name Age
Robert Tatham 50
Jane Tatham 44
Margt Tatham 19
Frances Tatham 13
Mary Jane Tatham 9
John Tatham 6
John Teale 63
James Tatham 53
Joseph Bentley 29

by Delia on 2011-04-14 07:48:20

Thanknyou for all your research.

Our Frances Tatham died 13 Aug 1872 in Ballarat, Victoria, Australia so John could not have been a widower in 1871. John died 1 Aug 1876 so it would be interesting to see if he is still listed as resident with Robert in the 1881 census. I did try to access this online but my research skills are very sketchy and I failed miserably.

I shall get my own copy of John's death certificate to see if it very useful. I have got the previous info from family members.

Perhaps this is not our family that you have found.

I did see the family with Elijah Tatham as the father of Robert, David and Frances and thought perhaps martha was martha riley. I found a Martha Riley married Elijah Tateham 16 Oct 1815 at St Bartholomews, Colne, Lancashire, England.

I also found a James and Betty Taitham baptised in the same church on 9 Nov 1817.

For your assumption to be true about Martha Teal, we need to find Martha Tatham's husbands date of death, to allow her to marry John Teal.

I also tried access familysearch.org for john and Frances' marriage after Martha's death, but once again the internet played up so I shall leave that for another day.

As you say the plot thickens, but i do wonder if they did change their name when they came to Australia.

by asheppard on 2011-04-14 19:57:38

Do you have the details of their arrival in Australia.

It's interesting that I can't find the family in the 1881 no Robert or Jane and no John either but I also couldn't find any deaths that match. I wonder if they returned to Australia together after the 1871 census.

As for John being a widow in the 1871 it could have been a little fib or a mistake by the person who wrote the details and we know how many they made thousands, makes searching a little difficult.
I have one census with a five year old as married and his father as widow and his mother as unmarried born in Dundee Aberdeenshire England, and the five year old was born 10 years before the father just a tad out of whack. Sometimes you have to do a little detective work to sort it all out.

I'll keep digging and maybe something will turn up.
regards Anastasia

by asheppard on 2011-04-14 20:11:33

Just found this death
Elijah TATEHAM

England Deaths and Burials, 1538-1991
burial: 05 Aug 1824 Skipton, York, England

record title: England Deaths and Burials, 1538-1991
name: Elijah Tateham
gender: Male
burial date: 05 Aug 1824
burial place: Skipton, York, England
indexing project (batch) number: I03298-2
system origin: England-EASy
source film number: 919156

This fits with her marriage to John TEAL in 1828.

So did John TEAL marry his stepdaughter Frances TATHAM there was only 12-15 years between them and it's not unheard of, OR is Frances not Frances TATHAM by birth but by marriage. Who knows at the moment I will keep digging.

by Delia on 2011-04-16 19:45:34

We haven't been able to find how the Teal's arrived in Australia, but shock horror!!!! I found a John Teal aged 63 left Melbourne for London in November 1870 on the ship Somersetshire on the PROV website for Index for Outward Passengers. This is the right age for our John Teal as he was born about 1807.

More shock horror!!!! A John Teal came to Australia aboard the ship Great Britian in July 1971 from a British Port.

But I couldn't find any the Tathams or Tatehams come into Victoria after 1871. Perhaps they went to another Australian state or America.

I shall endeavour to find the shipping records for the other states this week.

by asheppard on 2011-04-16 22:09:47

The things you find when you start poking around.

So if the Martha TEAL who died in 1852 Skipton is the widow of Elijah and the wife of John then maybe he left England shortly afterward to come to Australia.
He could very well have arrived in another State, Frances could have come with him as step daughter or wife, could be worth looking under both TEAL and TATHAM/TATEHAM, you never know what you might find.

I still can't find a marriage between the two, it may come down to purchasing either Elijah 1852 or Elizabeth 1846 birth certificate to get more details of Frances.

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