itellya on Family Tree Circles
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NOSELESS BRYAN RINGROSE, AUSTRALIA, who "emigrated from Newark, Nottinghamshire, probably around 1853".
EMAIL TO WOADY YALOAK HISTORICAL SOCIETY.( firstname.lastname@example.org). A big thank you to janilye!
A couple of years ago Margaret Roberts, your research officer, replied to my email about Bryan Ringrose. His obituary was found by my family tree circles mate, janilye, who said that it proved that Bryan Ringrose of Smythesdale and Bryan Ringrose of Red Hill, near Dromana, were not one and the same.
However the 1865 reference to Mrs Ringrose of Red Hill, which initially seemed to disprove the connection, and rate records which correlate nicely with the time of Bryan's arrival in N.S.W., are discussed under the obituary, which shows the Ballarat/Wicania connection. Janilye has since added further detail.
Regards, XXX XXXX, Rosebud.
POSTSCRIPT. IT IS POSSIBLE THAT MRS RINGROSE, WHO WOULD HAVE BEEN BRYAN'S MOTHER RATHER THAN HIS WIFE, DIED CIRCA 1870 BECAUSE FROM ABOUT THIS TIME, BRYAN WAS ASSESSED ONLY AS THE OWNER, NOT THE OCCUPANT, OF THE RED HILL PROPERTY.
Death of Mr. Bryan Ringrose
Another old colonist in the person of
Mr. Bryan Ringrose passed away at
the Tibo0burra Hospital at 9 a.m on the
30th. inst. aged 7? years. Mr. Ringrose
arrived in Victoria in the stirring times
of the early 50's and was identified with
the mining interest at Ballarat, but sub-
sequently came to the western part of
this state and has resided in the Wilcan
nia and Milparinka districts for the last
25 years. Mr. Ringrose was a Justice of
the Peace and took a keen interest in
all that concerned the welfare of his
adopted country. In Politics he was
liberal to the point of prudence, but an
uncompromising opponent of class legis-
lation and the socialist spirit that per
vades the political atmosphere of the
day, but neverless his sympathies
were strongly in favor of [?ac?]ting the
condition of the toiler. He was a man of
sound judgement, of [??] demeanour,
courageous, of social habits, a staunch
friend and typical of the middle class
Englishman to which he belonged. So
far as is known, Mr. Ringrose was never married. (P.2, Western Grazier, 30-12-1903.)
by itellya on 2015-01-24 21:41:30
NOSELESS BRYAN RINGROSE, CROWN ALLOTMENT 18B,KANGERONG,(MELWAY 90 K1).
This comment was prompted by a search of my Red Hill dictionary history to see if there was a DITTERICH entry. There wasn't and there wasn't anything about the family under SHAND. Then I spotted the RINGROSE entry and thought I should explain why I called Bryan "noseless".
The Kangerong parish map can be accessed online by googling KANGERONG, COUNTY OF BOURKE. Crown allotment 18B, consisting of 59 acres 3 roods 15 acres, was granted to B.Ringrose but the date of issue is not given on the map. The block was south of Four Winds(18A,granted to Henry Dunn, at the corner of White Hill and McIlroys Rds) of almost the same size and to the east a much later grant (possibly closer or soldier settlement)of 22 acres obtained by S.P.Calder, who was possibly the architect who designed the 1928 Shire hall in Dromana and son of the first C.R.B. Chairman, William Calder, who was President of the Red Hill Show committee until his death; a show report stated that William's "Four Winds" could be seen from the showgrounds.
Crown allotment 18B had a 2243 link (451.219824 metre) frontage to the east side of the road from Moat's corner between a point opposite the Tumbywood Rd corner and 1879 links (377.994672 metres)south of McIlroys Rd and a point opposite the present Sheehans Rd corner. My practically illegible paper map shows that about half of the property later became two adjoining closer or soldier settlement blocks, one fronting White Hill Rd and neither adjoining Four Winds.
(Reference to Sam Loxton deleted.)
BACK TO NOSELESS BRYAN RINGROSE. (EXTRACT FROM RED HILL DICTIONARY HISTORY JOURNAL.)
RINGROSE 1865. The illegible writing in the 1865 assessments led to me transcribing this name as Ringrove. The pioneer had 60 acres. The name of Mrs Ringrose appeared in George McLear's account book in 1865.
The Ringrose family evidently settled on its 60 acre grant (whose location is described in the entry for Arthur E.HILL)in 1865 but the rate collector didn't know much about them and failed to provide an initial for the surname which I guessed was Ringrove. The assessment of 1868 records the occupant of the 60 acres (i.e. 18B Kangerong) as Brian Ringrose.
It seems that this pioneer had been much concerned in public affairs at Smythesdale before coming to Red Hill, that is if his given name was Briant! After finding that Mr Ringrose was forever moving and seconding this and that according to a Ballarat newspaper, The Star, I came across an article on page 3 of the 23-5-1863 issue, which stated that Mr Briant Ringrose was the manager of the Great Trend Co. An advertisement on page 4 of the 18-2-1862 issue of The Star shows that Bryan Ringrose was the manager of the Reliance Gold Mining Company whose operations were to be at Scarsdale; however, he was later taken to court for not paying calls on his shares. After the accident mentioned below, Ringrose was taken to Scarsdale.
Mr Ringrose had been one of 18 men proposed by a meeting in 1861 for the municipal election of seven members. Smythesdale had much interest in communal activity and an exhibition was planned. In an article about the planning committee, an interesting item found underground by Mr Bryan Ringrose was mentioned. (The Star 19-9-1861.) Mr Ringrose was a member of the local Turf Club (13-9-1862 page 1s),and on the committee of the cricket club (1-11-1860 page 2). He was a manager or shareholder at several gold mining companies such as the Great Trend, the Reliance, the Mount Bute (The Star 3-11-1862 page 4)and, one would think, finally, the Cape Clear, where Bryan found he no longer had a nose for business. (Sorry Bryan, I deserve punishment for that one!)
It would be fortunate if our Red Hill pioneer had spent his previous time at Ballarat rather than in Tasmania (as Trove demonstrates) but not so fortunate if our Briant/Bryan Ringrose had moved to another mining company by November 1863; if so,he no longer had a nose. (The Star 25-11-1863 page 2.) This explosion took place at
Sprindallah where Bryan Ringrose had applied for a mining lease in 1861 but then withdrawn his application (The Star 5-11-1861, page 3.)
It would seem that Bryan Ringrose decided that a quiet farming life was better suited to a man who had been disfigured and moved to Red Hill within a year of his accident. After the article of 25-11-1863, there was no more mention of Bryan Ringrose of Smythesdale!
There is not yet proof that the Smythedale pioneer was also the Red Hill pioneer. I have not even found a Brian/Bryan Ringrose in genealogy websites apart from one in New Zealand. I have asked the historical society which covers Smythesdale if they have any record of Bryan Ringrose being still in that area in 1865. (See end of RINGROSE entry!)
Today, I traced the Ringrose grant year by year and these are my findings.
All entries relate to 60 acres of land in Kangerong.
2-9-1865. 1-9-1866. 1-9-1867. Ringrose (surname only) was assessed on 60 acres, Kangerong, a house being first mentioned in 1867 but probably there all the time.
5-9-1868. The given name, Brian, is recorded for the first time . The house had one room.
4-9-1869. The given name was altered with a stroke (/) to turn i into y. The house is not mentioned.
3-9-1870. There are no assessment numbers but the person to be rated is recorded as Bryan Ringrose.
2-9-1871. No Ass. No. After Bryan Ringrose's name that of William Hillas (sic) is written in inverted commas, probably indicating that William Hillis was leasing the 60 acres. William Hillis was not assessed on any other land (P.S.IN THE PARISH OF KANGERONG.)
7-9-1872. No Ringrose. No assessment numbers. William Hillis was assessed on the 60 acres under H. One would assume that he had bought the land but with these rate collectors it is dangerous to assume anything.
6-9-1873. No Ass.No. Under H, William J.Hillis is crossed out and Francis Hirst is written above it. The owner's name, Ringrose, is not forgotten as it was in 1872.
5-9-1874, 2-10-1875, 15-9-1876. Under H, Francis Hirst was assessed each time with the owner being, respectively: Ringrose, Bryan Ringrose and Blank! Had it been sold this time?
14-9-1877. No listing under H (Hirst) or R (Ringrove). Look at every assessment in Centre Riding for 60 acres Kangerong or Ringrose in "Owner" column. Job Sherwood was leasing the 60 acres from B.Ringrose.
27-7-1878. Job Sherwood still leasing from B.Ringrose. N.A.V. was 14 pounds. (I hadn't checked it previously but I did notice it had been 10 pounds earlier on.)
24-7-1879. Nothing under S. Nothing under R. Look through all centre riding assessments. Under D, Charles Daniel was recorded as leasing from B.Ringrose.
31-7-1880, 30-7-1881. Nothing under D. Check whole of centre riding again for 60 ac K or Ringrose in owner column. The property had been forgotten (see ASSESSMENTS entry) and at the very end it was noted, without an assessment number, that what looked like John Gawin was leasing from B.Ringrose. The 1881 entry was clearly John Galvin and he was a labourer but the owner column was blank. Had Galvin bought 18B Kangerong?
29-7-1882, 21-7-1883.(A.N. 276 and 275/150, in shire, in riding.) Occupant column blank but Bryan Ringrose was listed as the owner in both years. The 83-4 rates were paid by Mr Ellis on 26-5-1884. I think we can assume that Ellis meant Hillis.
19-7-1884. (Nothing near previous assessment numbers.) Check whole riding for 60 acres K or Ringrose in owner column. (A.N. 110.) William Kemp, orchardist, was leasing from B.Ringrose.
20-7-1885. Not one Kangerong property of 60 acres was listed. No Ringrose in owner column. This looks like it!
17-7-1886. I wrote nothing so the result must have been the same as for 1885.
16-7-1887. Between Rudduck (157) and Segrave (158) but with no assessment number or occupier name, Ringrose was listed as the owner. The rates were paid by Hillas (sic.)
Blank July, 1888. A.N.28. Ringrose in owner column.
Blank July, 1889. No 60 acres Kangerong assessed. Had it been absorbed into a large landholding or had the rate collector forgotten the property again? Hardly any entries in the owner column and no sign of Ringrose.
Blank July 1990. No 60 acres Kangerong or Ringrose. A retrospective examination re William Hillis made sense of a baffling entry in 1891. In 1890, William Hillis was assessed on 273 acres in Wannaeue and Kangerong; to the left of this description, in tiny numerals, 60 was written above 213 (A.N. 98.) One would assume that this meant 60 acres in Wannaeue and 213 acres in Kangerong but as I said before, with these rate collectors don't assume anything.
William Hillis was granted 23A Wannaeue on 12-11-1888 and 23B Wannaeue on 10-12-1885. The first consisted of 59 acres 3 roods and 34 perches and is roughly indicated by Melway 171 H, part J-6. The second consisted of 153 acres o roods and 36 perches and is indicated by 171 pt.J, and K, 5-6. With 40 perches making a rood and 4 roods making an acre, the total of these two allotments is 213 acres and 30 perches. Therefore the 60 acre block was in Kangerong. Segrave's 60 acres were in Flinders and the only other 60 acre block, apart from Bryan Ringrose's 18B Kangerong, was Henry Dunn's "Four Winds" but this had become 233 acres years earlier.Therefore the land on which William Hillis was assessed in 1890 should read: 60 acres, 18B Kangerong and 213 acres, 23 AB Wannaeue.
Blank July, 1991. William Hillas (sic) was assessed on 60 acres Wannaeue and Kangerong. Perhaps William had mortgaged his grants or they may have been sequestered so he only had Bryan Ringrose's grant but because the rate collector wasn't sure whether the 60 or the 213 acre land was in Wannaeue, he kept the Wannaeue and Kangerong tag.
Blank July 1992. William Hillis could have had 60 acres Kangerong (preceded by an ink blot that looked a bit like a one or 160 acres.
If our Bryan Ringrose was disfigured and not often seen in public, it seems that William Hillis was one of his few friends. The following is being placed here rather than in the HILLIS entry so that it can be seen in context regarding the information from the rate books.
Bruce Bennett states on page 22 of THE BUTCHER THE BAKER THE:
William Hillas (sic) owned land on the corner of Wilsons and Main Creek Rd (i.e. 23 AB Wannaeue) and 27 acres on the top of White Hill including Watermill Farm. He was named as a butcher in the 1884 rates and appears to have been Red Hill's first butcher.
While reading an extract from Joseph McIlroy's diary on page 19 of Sheila Skidmore's THE RED HILL, where Joseph mentioned staying the night at Mr Hillis's place while bringing a steer back from Frankston on 9-3-1881, I was thinking of the Wannaeue land and presumed that for some reason he had travelled via Eaton's Cutting. Now it is pretty clear that he had travelled up White Hill Rd from Moat's Corner and stopped near the McIlroys Rd corner. William Hillis may have been leasing S.P.Calder's much later grant. He could not have been on Bryan's 18B because John Galvin seems to have been there from July 1880 to July 1882.
I received the following reply from Margaret Roberts, Research Officer of the Woady Yaloak Historical Society. Dear ---, I have searched through all our records and I have reached the same conclusion as you. The Brian Ringrose who was at Red Hill is most probably the same one who was at Smythesdale/Browns/Scarsdale in the early 1860's. Did you notice there was also a Joseph Ringrose here as well? A brother or father maybe as they were involved in many of the same mining ventures.
As you have surmised I have found no records of either of them after the accident. The two doctors who attended the victims, Drs Foster and Saengar were two of the best doctors in the area. Dr Foster was at Piggoreet and would have been the closest doctor to the accident whereas Dr Saengar was at Scarsdale and would have been the next closest. Poor Dr Saengar was murdered in September 1865 by a deranged man in Scarsdale. Please note that Smythesdale has an S in the middle. I noticed that in your article on him in the Red Hill article you omitted it. Good history though, congratulations.
Thanks Margaret for all your trouble. Sorry about the missing S which I have now remedied.
by itellya on 2015-01-24 22:21:57
iF YOU THINK THAT IT'S FAR-FETCHED TO PRESUME THAT BRYAN RINGROSE MOVED FROM NEAR BALLARAT TO (OUR) RED HILL, HERE'S ANOTHER BLOKE THAT DID PRACTICALLY THAT. ONE OF HIS SONS, THE CRACK RIFLEMAN I THINK, WHO TOURED THE LAND AS A SORT OF BUFFALO BILL TO SHOW THAT A CERTAIN RIFLE OR AMMUNITION WAS SUPERIOR, MARRIED A Red Hill HUNTLEY GIRL.(Bill Huntley.)
DAVID MAIRS OF THE PARISHES OF BLACKWOOD AND BITTERN, VIC., AUST.
by itellya on 2012-08-26 10:51:08. page views: 1112, comments: 5
by janilye on 2015-01-28 14:35:20
Bryan Ringrose with the mining interests at Ballarat died at the Tibooburra Hospital in NSW on the 30th. December 1903.
I'm attempting to correct the impossible copy now.
by janilye on 2015-01-28 15:06:03
So no! not your Red Hill Ringrose
Here's your proof
by itellya on 2015-01-28 16:59:55
Fantastic find janilye. I'll have to pass it on to the historical society lady who replied to my email about Bryan. It seems likely that Bryan had moved away by 1885 (see assessments on 18B Kangerong.) This would fit in well with him settling in N.S.W.in about 1888. As the farm was obviously unoccupied and the current owner could not be determined, there might have been an assessment under O (for owner) in 1885/6 and 1886/7. This was standard procedure when a farm was unoccupied and the rate collector was unsure of its ownership. The Mrs Ringrose in George McLear's account book of 1865 (P.91 of Colin McLear's A DREAMTIME OF DROMANA)could have been Bryan's mother. It stands to reason that Bryan did not marry but my assumption that he would have shunned public appearances was way off the mark,given his continued political activity post 1888.
Given his arrival in his new abode in N.S.W. soon after ownership of 18B Kangerong became unclear and the possibility that Mrs Ringrose of 1865 was Bryan's mother, it cannot be concluded that Bryan Ringrose of the Ballarat area and N.S.W. was not also the Red Hill pioneer. Perhaps Bryan's mother died circa 1884-5 and he, having probably been caring for her for some years,was free to experience adventure again.
by janilye on 2015-01-28 17:02:58
For those researching Bryan RINGROSE Esq., J.P (miner) he emigrated from Newark, Nottinghamshire, probably around 1853 for he did mention in a speech, he had been in Ballarat since 1853. He was on the Bench in Balranald and Broken Hill from abt. 1890.
I believe he had a relationship with Joseph RINGROSE for they both bought shares in the same mines. Joseph, also a miner, lived in Scarsdale, Lal Lal, Elaine and Geelong
NSW.BDM 3374/1904 RINGROSE BRYAN 73 YRS TIBBOBURRA TIBOOBURRA
STATE RECORDS NSW. Intestate Estate Case Papers
RINGROSE Bryan - 0001
REMARKS Miner Died Tibooburra Hospital Native of England
LOCATION OF FILE[10/27662]
His Auriferous Leases in Milparinka began 29 June 1896 until 26 August 1899
by janilye on 2015-01-28 17:31:34
I mean't to add that in 1913 Bryan Ringrose Esq., J. P. (miner) appeared in this list in Adelaide.UNCLAIMED MONEY which is how I knew he was from Newark, Nott. and also unsure of his relationship with Joseph if any.
by janilye on 2015-01-28 17:45:35
And in this speech HERE he says he had been a miner since 1853.
I've tagged quite a few years in the life of Bryan in Trove and
I am not able to find any mention of Red Hill in the miner's life
When he was writing A DREAMTIME OF DROMANA (published after his death), Colin McLear had no TROVE to help him and unfortunately Miss Maude Eaton of Dromana had died in her 90's two or more decades earlier, in 1956. He probably assumed that Watson had received some medical training before leaving America with Abraham Griffith Snr. (and his gold mining brother, Mr Eaton.)
The index in Colin's book reads in part:
Eaton, Mr [gold miner] 54,68,69,72, 114, 156
Eaton, Watson 69,72,114,121,132
Eaton's Cutting 79.
FROM MY LONG-NEGLECTED D.R.A.M.A. ON TROVE.(HISTORY OF DROMANA,ROSEBUD AND MILES AROUND.)
EATON. Watson Eaton and his previously unidentified brother (whom Iâll call P.U. for the moment) came to Australia from Philadelphia with the Griffiths and they farmed together on Jamiesonâs Special Survey alongside settlers such as the McLears, Peateys and Clydesdales. Watson (had spent time studying medicine-WRONG) and was lauded for caring for the health of people far and wide before he died in 1877 following a fall while riding to a patient. He had settled on 150 acres on the west side of the south end of Eatons Cutting Rd and Rebecca Griffith, his executrix, received the grant. P. U. whose name was actually Bernard, had spent time on the gold fields, being at one stage a race* owner at Creswick. By the late 1880âs he was back in Dromana, operating a gold mine at the Tubbarubba diggings east of Moats Corner and employing the lads from the Moat, Peatey and Clydesdale families, which now lived near his mine. Bernardâs daughter, Maude, lived in Dromana until her death, her rates most likely being paid by Benjamin Eaton, a librarian who was possibly her brother. Harry Eaton must have been another brother. (*A race was a channel carrying water to mines for sluicing.)
The above was probably written in 2011 and I felt pretty smug. I don't like mysteries and after about six months I'd found the given name of Watson's gold mining brother. I did not expect an even more spectacular discovery. This is what I wrote on a "WANT TO EXPLORE DROMANA'S HISTORY?" sheet that I handed out to very appreciative families on the Dromana foreshore yesterday (Australia Day)in order to increase interest in the Dromana Historical Society museum.
"Watson Eaton,who served as the area's doctor for many years,never attended university or had any medical training but after his death in 1877 residents honoured his services with a marble memorial which can be seen in the museum."
The purpose of this journal is to provide a parking space for the article about an inquest etc. in which Watson testified that he'd never attended university or had any medical training. I have spent two fruitless hours trying to find it on trove, it is not in my Peninsula Dictionary,D.R.A.M.A. ON TROVE, or apparently in any of my journals. BUT I WILL NEVER GIVE UP.
AN INVESTIGATION OF WHEN MAIN CREEK NEAR DROMANA, BECAME MAIN RIDGE, AND THE INVOLVEMENT OF THE DITTERICH FAMILY IN ITS METHODIST CHURCH.
FROM AN EMAIL.
Hopefully the articles below will help. If there is no mention of the Ditterich family in connection with the Main Ridge Methodist Church (none found on trove either), they might have been quiet "behind the scenes" adherents or had a Metho/Pressy mix like the McIlroys.
From my journal:
THE SHIRE OF FLINDERS, MORNINGTON PENINSULA ...
DITTERICH Arthur Ralph 1961-4
Extract from my journal, PIONEER PATHWAY, DROMANA.
WEDDING AT MAIN CREEK. Weddings are as a general rule interesting subjects, either to write or talk about, and the one at Main Creek on the 5th inst., was no exception to the rule. On that date, Miss Christiania Shand, (youngest daughter of Alexander and Charlotte Shand) of Main creek, was united in wedlock to Richard, (youngest son of Richard and Eliza Ditterich of Canterbury. The ceremony took place at noon, and was performed by the Rev R. Brown, of South Melbourne, assisted by the Rev E. Smith of Dromana. The marriage took place in a very picturesque part of the garden, underneath an arch of evergreens, nicely interwoven with flowers. The bride who was given away by her father, was most becomingly dressed in a cream fancy cashmere, trimmed with lace, white tulle veil, and wreath of orange blossoms. Mr J. Shand acted as best man, principal bridesmaid, Miss Ditterich dressed in white dress and blue sash. Miss A.Gunson in white dress and blue sash ; Miss A. Crichton white dress and pink ribbons ; Miss E. Barker, white dress and cream sash. At one o'clock about 50 guests sat down to the wedding breakfast. The tables fairly groaning beneath the weight of good things, which were provided. After the usual toasts had been proposed and responded to, and the Revs Brown and Smith had each made a short speech, the party adjourned to the lawn where the bride and bridegroom had their photographs taken by Mr Wright, of Flinders. Shortly after this the carriage was announced, which was to convey the newly wedded pair and a few of the friends to the railway station, and amid a shower of good wishes and rice the party drove off for Mornington. They will shortly proceed to St Arnaud, in which circuit Mr Ditterich is engaged. During the afternoon games were freely indulged in by the guests. The party breaking up shortly before 6 p.m., owing to the inclemency of the weather. Everybody thoroughly enjoying themselves. (P.3, Mornington Standard, 14-4-1892.)
They or their descendants obviously came back to Main Ridge. The Main Ridge Cricket Club, whose President, Jason Albress, is a descendant of a Rye pioneer, plays on the A.R. and F.Ditterich Reserve. Arthur Ralph Ditterich was a Flinders Shire councillor 1961-4. The Shand family was probably related to the Downward family of Mornington, Tubbarubba and Kangerong; Downward Shand 1915-17 and John Shand 1902-7 and 1916-23 were also councillors of the shire.
Bill Huntley told me that all the Shands had moved to Gippsland by 1920 and the Ditterich family may have taken over their property. The Shands may have had property near Warragul while still at Main Ridge; there was a Cr Ditterich in the Warragul Shire in the 1880's.
The Ditterich family was at Main Ridge by 1926 where F.Ditterich dominated with bat and ball for Main Ridge in their victory over Ray Cairns' Boneo, scoring 71 of 154 and taking 5 for 85 with the assistance of R.Ditterich who took 3 for 46.(P.18, Argus, 24-11-1926.) I now know why the Ditterich family returned to Main Creek and that the two cricketers were Frank and Ralph. You will remember that Rev. Richard Ditterich married Christiana Shand. Richard's preaching had taken him to Launceston where he died on 9-9-1928, dearly beloved husband of Christiana and loving father of Ralph, Frank, Howard and Keith*.(P.1, Argus, 10-9-1928.)
*P.S. Eric Keith Ditterich could possibly have been related to the Main ridge mob. David Ditterich of Dromana, might know.
1979 Birthday Honours - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Keith Owen Shipley, OBE, lately Special Adviser to the Chief Minister, Gilbert Islands. ..... The Reverend Eric Keith Ditterich, of Glen Iris, For service to the Uniting ...
Bill Huntley told me that John Shand had done a lot of surveying in Gippsland. That would explain how Alexander Jnr came to marry a Gippsland gal and one of his sisters married a Gippsland lad, Rev. Ditterich.
METHODIST CHURCH REV. DITTERICH FAREWELLED.
Daily Telegraph (Launceston, Tas. : 1883 - 1928) Friday 16 April 1926 p 5 Article
... METHODIST CHURCH REV. D1TTERICH PAREWELLED. MELBOURNE, Thursday. â Rev. R. Ditterich, chief ... take charge of the lead ing Methodist church in Launceston Tasmania, was farewelled at an! afternoon ... 118 words
DEATH OF THE REV. DR. DITTERICH. PROMINENT METHODIST CHURCHMAN. Launceston, September 9.
The Advertiser (Adelaide, SA : 1889 - 1931) Monday 10 September 1928 p 19 Article
... DEATH OF THE REV. DR. DITTERICH. PROMINENT METHODISTCHURCHMAN. Launceston, September 9. The death ... the Methodist Church in the Victorian and Tasmanian conference. when he accepted an Invitation to come ... 174 words
It would seem that Main Creek became Main Ridge in local vernacular by 1926 but it is not proven that the name change was official*. Was it in 1927 that the cricket club changed its name?
* POSTSCRIPT. THE FOLLOWING SEEMS TO INDICATE THAT THE NAME CHANGE OF MAIN CREEK TO MAIN RIDGE HAD BEEN MADE OFFICIAL BY THE START OF 1925.
Mrs. Eden White, who was successful In her tender for carrying the mail, from Main Ridge to Red Hill,
has started her duties. Mr. M. Dalcom, of Main Ridge, was the former carrier.--"Post."
(RED HILL. Frankston and Somerville Standard (Vic. : 1921 - 1939) Wednesday 21 January 1925 p 1 Article.)
Knowing that post office information was sometimes the ONLY historical information about places on Wikipedia, I tried the MAIN RIDGE page but while it mentioned the name change,there was apparently never a post office. There does not appear to be a wikipedia entry for Main Ridge under its former name but the search uncovered an indication of how the place name applied to anyone living along the length of the creek from Bullocky Bob White near Whites Rd to the Tucks near Flinders.
Elizabeth Tuck 1847 - 1917 Main Creek, Victoria, Australia
WikiTree - Free Wiki Family Tree Â· login | register. no image ... Born March 7, 1847 in Main Creek, Victoria, Australia map. Daughter of Henry Tuck and Catherine ...
ROBERTS, MAIN CREEK/RIDGE.
FROM OUR OWN CORRESPONDENTS. DROMANA.
Mornington Standard (Vic. : 1889 - 1908) Thursday 19 September 1895 p 2 Article
... , of Main Creek, another old resident, joined the great majority last Tuesday week. Deceased had been ... was interred in the DromanaCemetery. A large number of people attended the funeral. Mr. C. Roberts
The Argus (Melbourne, Vic. : 1848 - 1957) Saturday 6 February 1926 p 20 Article
John Edward Roberts, aged 52 years, of Main
Ridge, Red Hill, near Dromana, orchadist, was
granted a decree nisi for the dissolution of his
marriage with Louisa Roberts, of Heidelberg road, Clifton Hill, on the ground of desertion.
DITTERICH, MAIN CREEK/ RIDGE.
WEDDING AT MAIN CREEK.
Mornington Standard (Vic. : 1889 - 1908) Thursday 14 April 1892 p 3 Article
... WEDDING AT MAIN CREEK. Weddings are as a general rule interesting subjects, either to write or talk ... about, and the one at MainCreek on the 5th inst., was no exception to the rule. On that date, Miss ...335 words
Text last corrected on 27 October 2012 by anonymous
This resource is likely to be relevant to your query (score: 1.263)
This resource is likely to be relevant to your query (score: 1.263)
In Memoriam. MRS. CHARLOTTE SHAND.
Spectator and Methodist Chronicle (Melbourne, Vic. : 1914 - 1918)Wednesday 25 July 1917 p 793 Article
... , of Main Creek, Dromana, entered into rest ori June 2nd, in her ninetieth year. Born in Tiverton ... , while 'her' youngest daughter is the. wife of the Rev. R. Ditterich. One other daughter -
COUNTRY CRICKET CONFERENCE.
The Age (Melbourne, Vic. : 1854 - 1954) Thursday 10 December 1925 p 7 Detailed Lists, Results, Guides
... , Greaves 15, Beck IS; Radford six for II, Ditterlch two for 21) defeatedMain Creek 131 (F. Ditterich 01, R ... . Ditterich 10; Maine three for S3, Cleino two for 1, Hansford two for 31).
SHAND, MAIN CREEK /MAIN RIDGE.
In Memoriam. MRS. CHARLOTTE SHAND.
Spectator and Methodist Chronicle (Melbourne, Vic. : 1914 - 1918)Wednesday 25 July 1917 p 793 Article
... , of Main Creek, Dromana, entered into rest ori June 2nd, in her ninetieth year. Born in Tiverton ... In Memoriam. MRS. CHARLOTTESHAND. . ' . ) Charlotte^ Sliand, wido w of the late Alexander Shand ... 332 words
Mornington Standard (Vic. : 1889 - 1908) Friday 23 April 1897 p 3 Article
... of I. Roberts E.q. Main Creek, Dromana Mrs Shand, Dromina 1 Mrsafohn D. CaUnea,.Bomaeo.. 2 Homie ... 3499 words
The Argus (Melbourne, Vic. : 1848 - 1957) Saturday 11 November 1939 p 4 Family Notices
... Alexander and Charlotte Shand, of Main Ridge. Dromana, dearly beloved uncle of Anne Milne, in his 81st yeur ... Interred Williams-town Cemetery ) WADSWORTH-On the 9th November nt Stawell Rowland Henry of Main street ... 6801 words
THE FIVE DIFFERENT FAMILIESWERE:
1.A Wilson family in Mornington from which one parent of Charles Bowman Wilson came.
2. Descendants of BONNIE WILLIAM OF DUNDEE, one of which, a "Tuerong Station" Wilson, was a parent of Charles Bowman Wilson.
3.Descendants of Sarah Wilson as detailed in Petronella Wilson's GIVING DESTINY A HAND.
4.Descendants of butcher turned bullocky turned butcher,Henry William Wilson, and Thamer (nee Burdett, both of whom are buried in Dromana Cemetery) as documented in A DREAMTIME OF DROMANA and LIME LAND LEISURE.
5.Descendants of G.M.Wilson who fought in the Boer War, married Jane,the daughter of Charles Graves Snr,(pioneer on Jamieson's Special Survey, Shoreham storekeeper and owner of "Woodlands" in the parish of Flinders.)
Re 1. I don't document families in places with historical societies but Val Wilson might have details on her excellent Mornington Cemetery website. I can't recall whether this family provided Charlie's mother or father.
Re 2. From Val Wilson's website.
John Bowman Wilson
John Bowman Wilson,John Bowman Wilson, William Sorell Wilson (photos.)
John Bowman Wilson was born in Tasmania on the 10th of October, 1830, and arrived in Victoria in 1857 with his wife Agnes and family, to try his luck on the Castlemaine goldfields.
John was also accompanied by his brother William Sorell Wilson and his family, who were on their way to manage âTruganinaâ, a property in Derrimut, Victoria.
By 1863, the family had moved to the Mornington Peninsula where, in 1869, John and William purchased âTuerongâ. John certainly did not have much luck farming because he became insolvent in 1880 and sold âTuerongâ back to his brother and his own son, Edwin.
The property is now largely subdivided into extensive vineyards, notably Red Hill Estate, Dromana Estate, Tuerong Estate and others. The freeway to Rosebud now passes through where the original property stood.
John Bowman died on the 13th of February, 1893, aged 62 and Agnes died a year later, aged 61. They are buried together in the Mornington cemetery.
With the exception of little Agnes Eliza Wilson, who is buried in the Castlemaine cemetery (died at age 2Â½ yrs), all of John Bowman and Agnes Elizaâs eleven children grew up and married and had their families, so that the Wilson family is today still well represented by the Victorian descendants of William Hartley Wilson and his wife Margaret (nee Bowman) - John and William's parents.
Johnâs ninth child, Chas, is also buried in Mornington Cemetery. John's grandson, Charles Bowman Wilson, who was born on 10 November 1903, became the Shire President of Mornington, and the C.B. Wilson Reserve on Wilsons Road in Mornington is named after him.
See much more in:
Stories 2 | Bonnie William - Bonnie William from Dundee
... Hastings farms of William Sorell Wilson & Family Â· Tuerong, Murder, Mystery, ... the Bonnie William clan to bring to our attention stories and documents about ...
Re 3. See my journals about Sarah (including how she led me to Henry Tuck),George Young and the Connells of Moorooduc as Petronella's book may not be borrowed. Names: LAURISSEN JOHNSON CHANGED TO JOHNSTONE, GOMM, CONNELL ETC.
Re 4. See sources quoted or google WILSON THAMER BURDETT GODFREY STENNIKEN to find a few of my journals about the family, and WILSON TOWNSEND MOUTH TO MOUTH for an extraordinary tale about the saving of a Wilson lad.
Re 5. Former councillor David Jarman started it all off when he suggested that I contact Peter Hemphill about the BACK TO RED HILL, adding that Peter was a "(grandson of Jerve Wilson) orchardist who served in the Boer war." Peter didn't know of any relationship to Sarah Wilson's descendants and Jean Rotherham told me to check with Bev Laurissen who was quite sure there wasn't one. I thought that Boer War records might give details about the soldier's parents but I couldn't find his service record.
That was when janilye came to the rescue.
And this is what I wrote to Peter.
Your grandfather may not have been a descendant of Sarah Wilson, pioneer on Jamieson's Special Survey, but your grandmother was the daughter of Charles Graves, who with a partner named Brown-Lee (according to a heritage study) leased the whole survey in 1851 when Henry Dunn's lease expired.
Charles was a hawker who travelled to Melbourne to buy goods that he would sell all over the peninsula, including the Cairns family's "Little Scotland" on the north east corner of Browns and Boneo Rds. His partner in the hawking business was Mary McLear whose husband had been killed near the Plenty River at the end of 1849; she arrived on the survey shortly after Charles Graves. Young George McLear helped by taking a change of horse to Frankston when Charles was coming back from Melbourne and his brother Bill accompanied Charles on one amusing visit to Little Scotland.(Pages 99,.34-5 A DREAMTIME OF DROMANA.)
Charles bought and fenced the property at Dromana which became the McLear family's "Maryfield" before becoming a storekeeper at Shoreham and a landholder in the parish of Flinders. As soon as I saw janilye's statement that your grandfather married Jane Graves, I knew who would be her father. Two death notices for Jane's brother prove that it was Charles Graves senior, the former hawker.
by janilye on 2015-01-25 16:18:36
Good heavens all this chasing your tails when you should have asked me!!
His name was Gervaise Maison Wilson and his service number was 508.
You'll find him on the Nominal Roll page 248.
All information is held at the Australian War Memorial which is now all online or a phone-call away.
Happy Australia Day.
by janilye on 2015-01-25 16:28:37
NAME: Gervaise Mason Wilson
BIRTH YEAR: abt 1880
DEATH PLACE: Dromana, Victoria
FATHER'S NAME: Alfred
MOTHER'S NAME: Flora Hunt
REGISTRATION YEAR: 1965
REGISTRATION PLACE: Victoria
REGISTRATION NUMBER: 20045
SPOUSE: Christian Jane Graves married 1908
by janilye on 2015-01-25 16:50:32
I see he was listed in the electoral rolls as Gervase Mason, however on his enlistment into the 3rd. Contingent the spelling of his name was Gervaise Maison.
Private Wilson was invalided back to Australia om 2 May 1901
Off to War.
by itellya on 2015-01-25 17:46:46
Thanks janilye, you're a marvel!
GRAVES.- On the 19th September, 1929, at Corowa (N.S.W ), Charles, son of the late Charles and Jane Graves, brother of T.J. Graves, Mrs J Symonds (Flinders), and Mrs G M Wilson (Red Hill), formerly of Flinders and Mornington.
GRAVES.-On the 19th September at Barina, Corowa, Charles, beloved brother of Isabella (Mrs Symonds), Thomas, and Jane (Mrs Wilson), aged 58 years, late of Flinders, Victoria.
(P.1, Argus, 20-9-1929.)
Extract from my journal:
RED HILL NEAR DROMANA (VIC., AUST.) POST 1940 and proposed BACK TO RED HILL.
GRAVES' (c/a 15, section A,Flinders,s/w corner Punty Lane and Tucks Rd. Only 190 acres. Melway 255 J5, H6, fronting the north west side of Punty Lane with the western boundary being from the creek in the exact centre of G6 to a point almost opposite 425 Tucks Rd.In 1900, Charles Graves Snr and Jnr were assessed on 374 acres, Flinders. I cannot establish where the other 184 acres were. )
A little farther along the road toward the coast we come to "Woodlands," a property of nearly 400 acres, belonging to Mr Graves, a very old resident of the district. Besides having a large orchard and garden, the
owner of "Woodlands" goes in largely for poultry farming. Mr Graves also conducts one of the oldest storekeeping businesses in the southern part of the Mornington Peninsula. The property is in good order and crops of any sort should grow well in the rich chocolate soil.
(P.2, Mornington Standard,20-9-1902.AROUND FLINDERS.)
See A DREAMTIME OF DROMANA re Charles Graves and his business partnership with Mary McLear before moving to Shoreham.
It is very difficult to ascertain the first use of present names of streets and roads in the shire on trove. There would be no record of why streets were so named, so assumptions need to be made. Unfortunately,it is very highly unlikely that Joseph Banks' botanist mate, who climbed Arthurs Seat with Flinders, was the person being honoured.
I believe that the Rye end of the road, where James Little Brown turned burrows and scrub into beautiful pasture was first named, with perhaps other names applied east of Weeroona St. Later it would have made sense to apply one name to the whole length of the road as seems to have happened between Truemans Rd and Rye where Guest St, named after the family of Ray and Alma Guest,extends outside the Almaray Estate into the pre-emptive right and east into Alf Doig's Oceanaire Estate.
When Flinders (and Kangerong till 1914)Shire let contracts for roadworks they would state how many chains and the names of residents at each end of the stretch of road BECAUSE VERY FEW ROADS HAD NAMES.
As late as 1943, some roads still had different names than they bear today and they were probably not official. See George Hill's death notice below. Rye Rd was most likely today's Melbourne Rd.
HILL.-On April 28, at his residence, Rye road, Sorrento. George, dearly beloved husband of Elizabeth, loving father of Lucy(Mrs. Waldon) Ethel (Mrs. Cain), William, Charles, Arthur, Bob, Mary (Mrs. Aslin), Eric, Len, aged 77.(P.2, Argus, 29-4-1943.)
Eastbourne Rd in Rosebud was called Ford's Lane in about 1902 because Cr William Ford had owned the 660 acre Wannaeue Station on its south side from Jetty Rd(the road near the state school) to Boneo Rd (which was known as the Flinders road) a couple of decades earlier. By 1920 Jack Raper, a former Essendon Football Club player and official, whose embarrassing surname was pronounced by Rosebud oldtimers as Roper, owned the Wannaeue Estate and the road was called Roper's Lane. It is now named after S.S.Crispo's grants, which he named Eastbourne and where he wanted the new nation's capital to be sited and named Federanium. Edward Williams, whose new homestead (17 WILLIAM Crescent- how stupid!) was built a few years after his mate's death,retain Crispo's name for the property.
In about 1904 when Robert Henry Adams and Back Road Bob Cairns were having a huge drainage dispute, today's Bayview Rd was called Hobson's Flat road by Robert Anderson of Barragunda, Cape Schanck (to which the road led, meeting today's Boneo Rd at Melway 253 C 9-10.) (P.2, Mornington Standard, 29-10-1904.)
Weeroona St, Rye was called Jennings Road, after the family went to Rye from Camperdown and bought land rehabilitated by James Little Brown to establish "Kariah". It was between Weeroona Rd and Dundas St (which was originally known as Browns Rd.)
It is unknown when Dundas St became known as Browns Road but one would suspect that it was after the c.1909 arrival of JAMES LITTLE BROWN.
FROM MY SHIRE OF FLINDERS JOURNAL.(Councillor entries.)
BROWN James Little J.P. 1915-22
(Postscript. Despite being called John in a long succession of assessments, the man after whom Browns Rd was named was James Little Brown.)
ROSEBUD. Mr J. L. Brown, who is opposing Mr Marsden in the West riding of the Flinders and Kangerong Shire, addressed the ratepayers on Tuesday evening. (P.3, Mornington Standard, 29-8-1914.)
At the last meeting of the Shire Council Councillor A.D.Forbes of the East Riding and Councillor J.L.Brown of the West Riding announced their intention of not seeking re election. The president (Councillor Macfarlan) and other councillors expressed regret at the announcements. In the Central Riding Councillor Wettenhall is opposed by Mr Holland of "The Rest" Flinders,and the contest is likely to be very keen.
(P.14, Argus, 17-8-1923, BALNARRING.)
LIME LAND LEISURE discusses at great length how James Little Brown arrived in Rye in 1909 on a pushbike, having previously been in the Mallee. He noted how similar the ti tree and rabbit infested area south of Rye was to King Island and bought much land that had passed into the hands of creditors. Patricia Appleford's RYE PRIMARY SCHOOL 1667, gives the same information but adds more detail.
Jim stayed for 18 days with Robert Rowley on the west side of Truemans Rd, south of Trueman's grant.Then he went to Melbourne and bought 1500 acres from banks and trust companies. In very short time, land was cleared, burned, fenced and sown with grass. The wire netting fences kept rabbits out and those trapped inside could not escape the inevitable.Overseen by James Cain and Robert Myers, well were dug and windmills installed to pump water into concrete troughs.
Within 12 months, Jim was selling fattened beef cattle. The rate collector may have made a mistake in 1910, unless Jim had a son called John. John H.Little Brown was assessed on:
245 acres (33AB, 35), 164 acres (29A), 102 acres (28A), 95 acres (26A) all in Wannaeue, and a total of 853 acres in the parish of Nepean (west of Weeroona Rd.)The strange thing is that there was no member of the Brown family assessed in the Wannaeue parish part of West Riding in 1919, with one exception! The location of each piece of Wannaeue land, with the name of the grantee, follows.
35, 173 acres, P.Sullivan, Melway 168 H-J11-12, 251H-J1,adjoining The Dunes.
33A, 148 acres, P.Sullivan, 251 J 2-3, K3.
33B, 40 acres, J.B.Davies, 251, K2.
29, 164.5 acres, J.Spunner, 252 D1-3.
26A, 21.5 acres, W.A.Blair Jnr, bottom third of 252 F-G 1 with a 228 metre frontage to the west side of Truemans Rd and extending to the east boundary of the Eagle Ridge Golf Course. The rate collector had it wrong; Crown allotment 26, granted to Edward Ford, consisted of 95 acres 2 roods and 20 perches and was obviously the land being assessed..
26, 95 acres, E.Ford, 252 G2-3, with frontages of 784 metres to Truemans Rd and 334 metres to Limestone Rd.
The rate collector took the easy way out by writing only "853 acres Nepean".
It is stated in LIME LAND LEISURE that the first land that James Little Brown improved was south of Rye Township between Dundas St and Weeroona Rd. Whether this included suburban lots 10,11 and 12 of the township (roughly 200 acres) which became the Ryelands Estate (McDonald's former golf course) is unclear, but a map in the book seems to indicate that it adjoined the cemetery. South of the Golf Pde corner were crown allotments 4, 20 and 21 of the parish of Nepean, a total of 374 acres,212 acres of which became Dod Jennings' Kariah in 1914. (See below for clarification.)
This SEEMS tobe blatantly incorrect, as does the claim that it was James Little Brown doing all the reclamation. There is only one mention of James Brown in the rates and that was in 1919, a decade after the reclamation commenced! John L.Brown was written as the ratepayer to be assessed on crown allotments 1, 2, 3 and buildings section 5 (under the heading of RYE, FOLIO 95, ASSESSMENT NUMBER 1882.) John is crossed out and James written above it. (I assumed that James was either the father or son of John Little Brown. If John was a rate collector's error, it is hard to imagine it being repeated for ten years. It was! See below.)
To confirm the claim that Brown arrived and bought land in 1909, I checked the 1909-10 assessments and found the Wannaeue details as in 1910 but also details of the land in the parish of Nepean; there were no entries for 1908-9. The Nepean details were:
24, granted to J.Purves, 99 acres, Melway 251 E1, fronting Dundas St, adjoining The Dunes.
17, 18, James Purves, 282 acres, Melway 168 B-D11,fronting Browns Rd, adjoining Ocean Reserve.
25, J.Purves, 82 acres, Melway 251E1, fronting Dundas St.
26, J.Purves, 111 acres, Melway 251 F2, fronting Dundas St.
32, John Cain, 176 acres(actually about 27 acres), Melway 167 F5, Miller, Topaz and Bath Sts to Harleian St.(See correction below.)
10, 11, Owen Cain, 103 acres (actually 177 acres), Melway 167, J-K 3-4, south to Fern St playground.
Section 5 of Rye Township is that area bounded by Collingwood St, Napier St, Ballabil St (and the south boundary of Kanasta Caravan Park) and Dundas St. James Brown was occupying the whole of section 5's 13 acres in 1919, after his name had replaced John's, and it may well have been the first area restored by James Little Brown but every other piece of land was supposedly turned into beautiful pasture by John Little Brown. Danny Jennings thinks that the Brown homestead on section 5, which is still standing, is 1 May Ave.
I have followed the progress of John Little Brown in 1909, 1914, 1917 and 1919 as he transformed rabbit and ti tree wastelands into this beautiful pasture. By 1914, he only had 202 of the 853 acres on which he had been assessed in the parish of Nepean, part of Owen Cain's Tyrone. He still had it in 1917 but not in 1919.By 1914, he had added land, south of Limestone Rd in the parish of Fingal. This land consisted of crown allotments:
5B, granted to E.Ford, 63 acres, Melway 252 H-J4, bounded by Limestone and Sandy Rds; a maze ing!
8B, granted to J.L.Brown on 1-12-1916, Melway 252 G7, fronting Maxwells Rd from No.131 to about a third of the way between No.180 and No.239. The Fingal land was retained in 1917 but sold by 1919.
By 1916, 28 AB and 29 Wannaeue were occupied by James and John Orr of "Kia Ora", Broadmeadows (Melway 5 H4.) By 1919 the 323 acres were occupied by Tommy Loft who had land at Greenvale, moving shortly afterwards to "Dalkeith" at Tullamarine (Melway 15 G-H 1-2.) Tommy started the Tullamarine Progress Association and was the Methodist Sunday School Superintendent for umpteen years; the late Ray Cairns remembered Tommy fondly.
JUSTICES OF THE PEACE MELBOURNE , Monday. The following were appointed justices of the peace at the meeting of the State Executive Council today: J. L. Brown of Rye, T. Falls, Caulfield. Central Bailiwick; II. S. &Ã¯Â¿Â½~btnoo etc.(P.4, The Ballarat Courier, 10-10-1916.)
SWAN HILL HOSPITAL MONTHLY MEETING. The monthly meeting of the committee of management of the Swan Hill District Hospital was held on Friday night. Present-Messrs. Chas. t M'Donald (in the chair), ,W? Moore, J.. a Wright, T. M. Ghisholm, P.-Real and F.' arris. Correspondence. From J. L. Brown, Rye, in relation to septic tanks, and stating that tanks at certain hotels and other places at Sorrento were given satisfaction. -Mr. Brown to be thanked for the information supplied. (P.2,Swan Hill Guardian and Lake Boga Advocate, 16-8-1915.)
This seems to indicate that Brown had retained links with the Mallee town. I'm sure the journalist was responsible for the use of given instead of giving.
FLINDERS AND KANGERONG SHIRE. Mr Brown, Rye, applying for wire netting.-To be attended to.(P.4, Mornington Standard, 11-3-1911.)
Railways Standing Committee at Flinders. The members of the above committee-Messrs Cameron (chair man), Hicks, Melville, Billson, Ward and Hutchinson-visited Flinders on the sth inst, to take evidence on the question of railway extension on the Peninsula. Though the notice was short the residents submitted a splendid exhibition of all varieties. The fodder, root crops, and vegetables were remarkable ; and if anything, superior to those forward at any local show. The general and comprehensive exhibits of Messrs Barger and Buchanan were conclusive proof of the suitability of the district for a wide variety of products of the highest quality. Messrs Higgins, Kennedy and Davies submitted fine samples, and Mr D. Cairns showed one stool of wheat showing 64 stalks. Mr Brown's mellilotis grown on the hitherto useless sand drives at Rye was much admired.
(P.3, Mornington Standard, 15-2-1915.)
I rang Linda Berndt to check on the ancestry of Cr Graeme Jennings and as an afterthought, asked if she knew anything about John/James Little Brown. She did!
James Brown's father was James L.Brown (c. 1821-Nov.1895)and his mother was Jane (nee McGuffie, c.1825-March 1911.) James was their first child, born in 1866 at Glenlyon, but was virtually an only child because Robert (c.1868-5-9-1869) died in infancy. The Rye pioneer's parents and brother were buried at Glenlyon.
In 1903,James was enrolled as a voter at both Bunyip South and Swan Hill; Jane Brown, possibly his mother, also being enrolled at Swan Hill. In 1909 he was described as a grazier and enrolled at Bunyip South and Bendigo, his address at the latter being Bayne St, as it was for Jane Brown.
James Little Brown married Margaret Annie Short in 1911. She was the sister of Rye identity, Tommy Short, who used to drive all the Rye youngsters to dances at Boneo etc. See pioneers' recollections in RYE PRIMARY SCHOOL 1667. This year also saw the death of James' mother, Jane. His wife's name was recorded as Anne Margaret or Annie Margaret on electoral rolls in 1911 (Rye), 1919 (Rye), 1924 ("Inverleigh", Thomas St, Dandenong),
1931, 1936, 1937 (5 Trentham St, Sandringham, 1936, 1937, and 1942 (88 Bay Rd, Sandringham.) In 1954, James was still living at 88 Bay Rd but Margaret's name was not on the electoral roll.
Thank you Linda!
Further rate research revealed the following.
J.L.Brown must have told the rate collector in 1911 that his name was actually JAMES because John was crossed out and James written very faintly above it (Assessment No.823.) Too faintly it seems because when he was preparing the next assessment, he must have missed the alteration and perpetuated the "John" myth. It seems that James was sick of this nonsense by 1919 when John was again crossed out and replaced with James. You'd think the rate collector would know the councillors' names, wouldn't you?
The 1911-12 rates also demonstrated the new occupants of the many properties that Jim Brown had remediated. My notemaking is unclear about William Dawson but he seemed to have had part of 35 Wannaeue. George Ball had 245 acres(33a,b and 35 Wannaeue), and 176 acres(32 Wannaeue-see below.) Jim Woonton had 164 acres (29), 102 acres (28A), and 95 acres (26A), all in Wannaeue. In 1912-13, George Ball had 245 acres, Andrew Leonard Ball* 214 acres, and Andrew, George and Hector Ball 261 acres.
Crown allotment 32 Wannaeue was not mentioned previously because the rate collector called it 32 Nepean in 1909 (assessment number 714.) This land consisted of 176 acres as the rate collector stated; he just had the parish wrong!Granted to J.A.Jenner in 1877, it fronts the east side of Springs Lane and the north side of Limestone Rd, its northern boundary adjoining The Cups Vineyard and Winery and its east boundary indicated by the west end of Kingston Heath. (Melway 252 B 1-3.)
When James Little Brown first arrived in Rye, he stayed with Robert Rowley for a while. The connection between the Doigs and Rowleys took place in the Mallee, and also the Shaws and Rowleys but I had assumed that was post world war 1. James obviously knew Robert before he arrived. It is possible that the family of J.L.Brown had previously lived on the Peninsula. James was obviously as keen to hear Robert Rowley's stories as Robert was to tell them. Thank you to Steve Johnson for another gem.
9th September 1924
"NO GOOD DAMPER INN."
TO THE EDITOR OF THE ARGUS.
Sir,-In the interesting article, "The Gippsland Mystery," on Saturday, by Ernest McCaughan, it is stated that a party of five whites and ten blacks were sent out under the leaderhip of De Villiers, an ex police officer who kept the extraordinary named No Good Damper Inn. Apropos of this, a story was related to me by the late Robert Rowley, then of Rye (a very old colonist who had known Buckley, the wild white man). The story, which may be of interest, is that about the year 1840 lime was being burnt about Sorrento and Rye. A layer of sheoak logs was laid on the ground, then a layer of limestone. Another layer of logs, then again stone, and so on, until there was a considerable stack. Fire was next applied. By this rough and ready, though wasteful, system, lime used in the building of early Melbourne was then burned. The lime was then "slacked", afterwards sieved through a fine sieve, and forwarded to Melbourne by ketch. One of these old windjammers had the misfortune to go aground near the site of Frankston. The lime was taken off undamaged, stacked, and care- fully covered a little way from the shore. A number of blacks were in the vicinity.
They had had some little experience of the white fellow's flour. When they found the lime, sieved and done up in small bags under a tarpaulin, they were sure they had got the genuine article in plenty. So they mustered in force, took away all they possibly could, and, fearing pursuit, did not stop running till they put about 12 miles between them and the stack of lime. The blacks then mixed their flour with water upon their 'possum rugs and put the dough in the ashes to bake, the result being spoiled rugs and bad damper. In the words of Mr. Rowley, "they called that place Dandenong," which means "no good damper.
-Yours, &c., J. L. BROWN, Sandringham, Sept. 8.
TO KNOW, KNOW, KNOW YOU
IS TO LOVE, LOVE, LOVE YOU.
So go the lyrics of a well-remembered song from my youth.
I know Dandenong,firstly as a place I passed through on my way to Bunyip holidays as a child. Secondly,in the 1980's when, as a 40 year old, I had the pleasure of boundary umpiring V.F.A. at Shepley Reserve and was captivated by the play of numbers 11, 21 and 31, one of whom was the great Darren Millane's brother.
Unfortunately Wikipedia's well-documented articles about places such as Dande do not inspire love.
Prior to the European settlement of Australia, the flat to undulating land was densely forested with red gum and was inhabited by the Woiwurrung Indigenous Australian tribe.
The name is generally thought to be derived from the Woiwurrung word "Tanjenong" meaning "lofty mountains" possibly referring to the nearby Dandenong ranges.
Another popular theory is that the name comes from 'bad flour', or 'no good damper'. A local tale revolves around local aboriginals obtaining a bag of lime and mistakenly using it to make damper. An old local hotel was the 'No Good Damper Inn'.
A third version has the name Dandenong coming from 'a burning' and 'the past' reflecting bushfires on the Dandenongs.
Joseph Hawdon established a pastoral run on Narra Narrawong in 1837, bringing cattle from Sydney by land. Soon a few timber cutters and a police camp were also located there. Dandenong Post Office opened on 1 July 1848.
By 1850, the whole area had been taken up for grazing. Dandenong Creek was first bridged in 1840. A road was made from Melbourne, making Dandenong, by the late 1850s, an important staging post for travellers into Gippsland. It became known as the 'gateway to Gippsland'. A township was surveyed in 1852. Milling of the red gum timber became an important industry, and charcoal burning, tanning, quarrying and brick making also flourished. A livestock market was established in 1866.
The Western Port Aboriginal Protectorate Station was located north-east of Dandenong from 1840 to 1844. This area had been an important meeting and ceremonial site for Aboriginal tribes. The Native Police Corps established its headquarters there until its disbandment in 1852. The Police Paddocks were then used for breeding and resting police horses.
By 1861, there were 40 houses in the township housing 193 people. Dandenong Shire was proclaimed in 1873. The Australian Handbook records the progress of the town by 1875.
The Dandenong Town Hall, Lonsdale Street, was built in Free Classical style in 1890 as the combined Shire Hall, Courthouse and Mechanics Institute, at a cost of about 12,000 pounds. The architects were Beswicke and Hutchins and the contractor McCullogh and McAlpine. The two-storey, stucco rendered brick building, on a bluestone base course, features a lofty, Mansard-roofed, corner clock tower and projecting end wings with serlian motif windows and capped by pedimented niches.
LET'S SEE WHAT I CAN DO ABOUT THE ROMANCE OF DANDENONG'S HISTORY.
DROMANA AND NELSON RUDDUCK.
One would hardly expect a history of Dromana to provide details about Dandenong pioneers,but Colin McLear's A DREAMTIME OF DROMANA does. It tells of Samuel Rudduck's arrival and land purchases in various areas; the later arrival of his son,Nelson,who was carting between Dandenong and Gippsland when he met Jane Sophia, daughter of a Mr Chapman who had been a pioneer on Tullamarine Island until a disastrous hay stack fire occurred, and was running a pub at Springvale; the move of Jane and Nelson to Dromana in about 1871; and the artistic talent of Fred Warren whose work graced Methodist churches in Dande and Dromana.
ROBERT ROWLEY AND NO GOOD DAMPER.
By the early 1900's the backblocks of Rye were rabbit and ti-tree infested. James Little Brown, whose family I believe had earlier lived in the area, transformed the disaster area in quick time into the beautiful pasture one sees during a drive along Browns Rd. Upon arrival at Rye, he stayed for about a fortnight with Robert Rowley who had burnt lime near the Heads with Henry Cadby Wells, renowned later as a Frankston pioneer. Imagine the two men chatting by the fire-side about the old days.
"NO GOOD DAMPER INN."
TO THE EDITOR OF THE ARGUS.
Sir,âIn the interesting article, "The Gippsland Mystery," on Saturday, by Ernest McCaughan, it is stated that a
party of five whites and ten blacks were sent out under the leadership of De Villiers, an ex-police officer who kept the extra-ordinary named No Good Damper Inn.
Apropos of this, a story was related to me by the late Robert Rowley, then of Rye (a very old colonist who had known Buckley, the wild white man). The story, which may be of interest, is that about the year 1840 lime was being burnt about Sorrento and Rye. A layer of sheoak logs was laid on the ground, then a layer of limestone. Another layer of logs, then again stone, and so on, until there was a considerable stack. Fire was next applied. By this rough and ready, though wasteful,system, lime used in the building of early Melbourne was then burned. The lime was then "slacked", afterwards sieved through a fine sieve, and forwarded to Melbourne by ketch.
One of these old wind-jammers had the misfortune to go aground near the site of Frankston. The lime was
taken off undamaged, stacked, and carefully covered a little way from the shore. A number of blacks were in the vicinity. They had had some little experience of the white fellow's flour. When they found the lime, sieved and done up in small bags under a tarpaulin, they were sure they had got the genuine article in plenty. So they
mustered in force, took away all they possibly could, and, fearing pursuit, did not stop running till they put about 12 miles between them and the stack of lime.
The blacks then mixed their flour with water upon their 'possum rugs and put the dough in the ashes to bake, the result being spoiled rugs and bad damper. In the words of Mr. Rowley, "they called that place Dandenong," which means "no good damper. âYours, &c., J. L. BROWN
Sandringham, Sept. 8. (P.4, Argus,9-9-1924.)
DR FARQUHAR McCRAE'S HASTY EXIT.
Two of Dandenong's streets are named after Dr Farquhar McCrae and John Fitgerald Leslie (Alphabetical)Foster. That is because the latter bought the Eumemmering run from the former. The deal did not go smoothly because the doctor had dudded Foster in some way. Foster challenged the doc to a duel and he fled to Sydney. Foster and his older brother William had another run called Leslie Park from 1840 in the parishes of Doutta Galla and Tullamarine. In 1843, William bought pre-emptive rights in both parishes straddling Sharps Rd and called his property "Springs". John bought land between Fosters Rd (now called Keilor Park Drive) and the Saltwater River which he called Leslie Banks.
Dr McCrae was an early grantee in the parish of Jika Jika, naming his property (bisected by today's Moreland Rd)after a family plantation in the West Indies called Moreland. However, the Doc had this farm managed by future Bulla pioneer, Michael Loeman, and bought "La Rose" on which he built the core of the historic bluestone WENTWORTH HOUSE on the north corner of Mitchell Pde and Le Cateau St(Melway 29 B1.) But then came the challenge from Alphabetical and Coiler Robertson bought La Rose.
The story of the challenge came from a history (possibly Richard Broome's BETWEEN TWO CREEKS, a history of Coburg), not trove, and I may never find an article about it. But the cause of it is easy to believe because Farquhar even reneged on repaying a loan that his brother, Andrew had given him,probably the reason Andrew was forced to become a squatter on Arthurs Seat circa 1843. The story described the doc's hasty departure for Sydney; is there any evidence of this? I did a "Dr Farquhar McCrae,Sydney" search on trove refined to the 1840's.
"McCrae Farquhar, M. D. Melbourne" was on a list of those qualified to give medical evidence at coroners" inquests.(The Sydney Gazette and New South Wales Advertiser (NSW : 1803 - 1842) Saturday 22 January 1842 p 4.) However he must have departed Melbourne soon afterwards because he landed a job as surgeon at the Sydney infirmary and dispensary when it opened in 1845*(SYDNEY DISPENSARY AND INFIRMARY.
The Sydney Morning Herald (NSW : 1842 - 1954) Thursday 29 January 1846 p 2 Article.)
Election of medical officers to the Sydney Infirmary and ...
Announcement of Dr. McCrae's candidature for the office of Surgeon to the Sydney Infirmary, about to be established, including his testimonials.)
*If I remember the Wentworth House heritage citation, Coiler Robertson was associated with "La Rose'from 1845.)
Did I remember the duel story correctly? I did read it nearly a quarter of a century ago!
Casey Cardinia - links to our past: Eumemmerring Run
Oct 29, 2012 - Foster also, in 1843, challenged Dr McCrae to a pistol duel over a land ... acres (747 hectares) in the Parish of Eumemmerring when he died.
The above website states that Foster held the run till 1842 when the lease was transferred to Edward Wilson (later owner, with the same partner, and editor, of The Argus, who retired because of blindness,to part of the Glengyle estate at Tullamarine which he named Arundel, and established a trust which helped Cr Jack of Flinders Shire to provide the Mornington Peninsula's first motorised ambulance) and James Stewart Johnston (later a prominent politician who established a vineyard on Craiglee at Sunbury.)
It also mentions that Alphabetical's cousin, William Stawell, drafted Victoria's(very squatter-centric) constitution, the author apparently being unaware that Alphabetical was involved as Colonial Secretary, and served as Acting Governor for a year after the ailing Latrobe's resignation.(William Stawell married a daughter of William Pomeroy Greene of Woodlands and Lady Stawell's memoirs can be seen at its historic homestead near Melbourne Airport.)
DANDENONG AND DISTRICT HISTORICAL SOCIETY.
Welcome to the Dandenong and District Historical Society. Our services are open to you.
Our mission is to collect, document, research, preserve and make available to the wider community for their enjoyment and education items that show the development of Dandenong and District from early settlement to present day.
Visit our Resource Centre:
(open Wednesday 10.00am to 3.00pm)
The Houlahan Centre
186 Foster Street East
Dandenong, Victoria, Australia 3175
PH: + 61 (0)3 9794 8967
Email us >
Details re services, fees and charges >
I haven't read that much about Dandenong's history, but on this group's website, I thought I'd see if they know CLOW. This is what came up.
Local Family Histories Index
Corner Corrigan Clow Crichton Criddle Crook Cruickshank Crump DDDD Dallimore Dana Dawson De George â¦
LETTERS FROM VICTORIAN PIONEERS.
Mr. James Clow writes:
In the beginning of August 1838,Rev. Mr. Clow took possession of the cattle run, Corhanwarrabul, which was so named after the mountain that formed its north-eastern boundary, but his home-station was at Tirhatuan, that part of the run which is adjacent to the junction of the Narrewong with the Dandenong. Before that period the more eligible portion of the country beyond him had been taken up. Mr. John Highett, he has been informed, was the first settler that crossed the Dandenong with stock, and that he was followed by O'Connor and the Ruffys, and that next after them came Mr. Joseph Hawdon, who may be considered the first that settled on the Dandenong, as those that had preceded him had gone about eight or ten miles to the east of it. He transferred his right to the Dandenong run to Captain Lonsdale, who had Mr. Alfred Langhorne for his overseer at the time Mr. Clow settled at Tirhatuan. Their head station was at the bridge over the creek, where the present township of Dandenong is situated. They had one out-station, Eumemmering, and both of these were transferred to Dr. McCrae in 1839; and shortly afterwards Eumemmering was transferred by him to the Fosters, and by them to Johnston and Wilson, and by them to Mr. Power, by whom it is still held. The Dandenong station was retained by Dr. McCrae
for several years, and then became the property of its present occupant, Mr. R. C. Walker. The run, which
belongs at present to Mr. Charles Wedge, and which is generally known by the name of the Waterholes, was a part of country originally occupied by Mr. Hawdon, and has been since then in the possession of various owners.
Along the Dandenong, on the east side, towards the mountain, and adjacent to Eumemmering, was the Corhanwarrabul run, which was occupied twelve years by Mr. Clow, and transferred by him to Mr. Beilby, its present owner. In 1840 he formed an out-station close to the base of Corhanwarrabul, on one of three rivulets, which fall into a swamp, and which, on issuing from it, at its south-west extremity, compose the Narrewong creek.etc. (P.3, Bacchus Marsh Express,1-8-1903.)
Mr. JAMES CLOW writes:
At the time the Tirhatuan Station was formed, some of the natives expressed a determination to be revenged on one of the servant men. As soon as they saw him there, they recognised him as one whose conduct towards some of their women, before he came into Mr. Clow's service, had given them great offence. He confessed that he had been to blame, and asked for his discharge, which was immediately given him,and he was safely returned to Melbourne. It is probable that, had they had an opportunity, they would have murdered him; but in doing so would they have done more than has been done by many Europeans, though in a more refined way?
Like other savages, they are naturally revengeful, but it is to be fearedthat on too many occasions their
atrocities have not been committed without grievous provocation.
The next settler on the Dandenong was Mr. Thomas Napier, who now resides in the parish of Doutta Galla*. His run, which he took up about October 1839, lay along the western side of the creek, and extended from the Tirhatuan bridge to Scott's bridge.
(*Google STRATHMORE, RAY GIBB, NAPIER for details.)
About a year afterwards he sold it to Mr. Scott, who died in Melbourne before he went to live there; but it was occupied by Mrs. Scott and family for two or three years, when they formed a small station on the other side of the creek, and sold the other to a family of the name of Drew.
It was afterwards subdivided and occupied by a number of small settlers, who were principally employed
in taking timber from that neighbourhood to Melbourne and other places for the purpose of building and the enclosing of purchased land.
Two brothers of the name of Rourke, who were, in the first instance, sawyers on Mrs. Scott's original run, formed the station, which the elder brother still holds near the sources of the Dandenong.
The aboriginal station of Narre Narre Warren was formed by Mr.Assistant Protector Thomas, and is so well known, that it is unnecessary for me to give you any account of it.
(See I SUCCEEDED ONCE by Marie Hansen Fels.)
The first settlers below the Dandenong bridge, and beyond the run belonging to Messrs. Lonsdale and Langhorne, were Mr. Solomon and Major Frazer. The former had his station above the swamp through which the Dandenong passes, and the latter below it on the bay, of Port Phillip.
About six miles in a north-easterly direction from Tirhatuan, on the south side of the principal stream
which descends from the mountain of Corhanwarrabul, and which mainly contributes to form the Narrewong Creek below the swamp, is the sheep station of Monbolloc, which was first occupied by Messrs. Kerr and Dobie. It is small and scrubby,and has passed through many hands since its formation.
On the east of Monbolloc is the small station of Will-Will-Rook,originally formed and still possessed by Mr. Varcoe and his family.
About the month of January 1850,during one night and a part of the succeeding day, an unusual noise,somewhat resembling that of a bush fire at a distance, was heard at Tirhatuan, and at an out-station about three miles off, situated near the Gap in the ranges behind Narre Narre Warren. At the former place it was heard by Mrs. Clow and others living there. She rose in the night time, and looked out to see if any of the huts was on fire; and during the day she went repeatedly into the verandah in front of the house to listen; and as the noise seemed to come from the rises on the west side of the creek, she sent two per(sic) as far as the bridge with a view to ascertain what it was. On their return they said they could not tell, but that when they were at the bridge the noise seemed to be at the house. The overseer happened to come, and she spoke of it to him, but he said that he had not noticed any unusual sound; neither did he then perceive any. He was in a hurry and went off immediately; but, happening to go to the outstation at the Mountain Gap, he was asked by the two men there,
both of whom had resided in the colony only a short time, and were therefore perhaps more liable to be
easily alarmed, whether the fire was coming that way. He said he did not know of any fire. They told him that they had not slept during the night, for they had heard a noise as of a great fire at a distance, and were afraid it was coming in that direction, and that they could still discern it. He was thus forcibly reminded of what he had just before heard, and on going a little way to a rise, he listened, and acknowledged that he could distinctly hear a noise similar to that which had been described, but could not tell what occasioned it.
As heard by Mrs. Clow, the noise was not always the same, but rose and fell, and after dying away for a little would begin again and gradually increase. To some it seemed to be in the air, but the prevailing impression
on her mind at the time, and that to which she is still inclined, is, that it was subterranean. It will perhaps be considered corroborative of this opinion that, on two previous occasions, an earthquake had been distinctly heard and felt there. The first was experienced in February or March 1843. It occurred at midnight, when the moon was full, the sky cloudless, and the wind still. To me and others who heard it at Tirhatuan, the sound was as if a light conveyance, making a sharp rattling noise, had passed rapidly between the house and the kitchen-these buildings being about eight yards apart.
The tremor, though distinctly felt, was not great; but at the outstation, near the base of the mountain, both the shock and the noise were very considerable. The two men sleeping in the hut were instantly roused, and ran out to ascertain what was the matter; but neither seeing nor hearing anything unusual, they conjectured what had happened; and as the shock was experienced in the same manner at Rourke's station, about five miles off, it would appear that it was severest along the base of the mountain.
To be continued.(P.3, Bacchus Marsh Express, 24-10-1903.)
Mr. James Clow writes:
The aborigines of this island consider that when they can compass the death of a friend or foe by stratagem instead of in open warfare it enhances their standing as skilful warriors according to their notions of one. Previously to the country which lies on the Western side of the bay of Western Port (between what was at one time Manton's and Allan's run) being occupied by squatters in the year 1835, the Gippsland blacks attackedsome five-and-twenty of the Western Port tribe in the gray(sic) of the morning, and cut off every one of them. Their tombs consist of many cairns plainly visible to this day.
When I went to reside at Dandenong in 1838, the blacks told me of the occurrence, and that they never had been able to avenge the wrong. Shortly after I settled amongst them I gave "Jack Weatherly," one of the tribe, a double-barrelled gun to procure for me the lyre-bird. He was employed occasionally in this way when opportunity offered, and with practice became a very good shot. One day, without my expressing a wish for any more of the
birds, he applied for a much larger supply of powder and shot than I had formerly given him at one time,
stating that a large party of his tribe were going to procure lyrebirds, and promising me, after four or five days, no end of curiosities in the shape of birds of the air and denizens of the forest. As he had always satisfactorily accounted for what he had before, I gave him it without reluctance. The days lapsed into weeks,when he stalked up to the station, evidently elated with some success, which he was not long in telling me.
After getting the powder, he went to council of war which was being held to take into consideration the glorious opportunity now presented to the tribe of avenging the onslaught I have alluded to above. The old men, who always shut their eyes and stopped their ears when they saw a gun being fired off, decreed that the powder and shot which had just been received from the various squatters on the ostensible plea of procuring lyre-birds, &c., should,by Jack Weatherly (who was appointed leader of the expedition) and those of his compeers who were proficient in the use of their guns, be buried in the skins of the wild blackfellows as they termed them
(to show them the new mode of warfare they had adopted, and thus to prevent a recurrence of their visits)-wild in contradistinction to the life of amity they themselves led with the white men.
After four days' march through the barren mountains which separate Western Port District from Gippsland, they on the fifth day sighted the smoke of some blacks' fires on the skirts of the beautiful pastoral district there. On the following day, about mid-day, they surprised the camp, making prisoners of all in it, which consisted only of some old men and some children. They then went in search of the able-bodied men, whom they espied very busily engaged in fishing on the banks of a large river not far off. They managed to sneak upon them within ten or twenty yards, and then blazed into them, killing or severely wounding every one of them, seven in number. Those who escaped the first volley jumped into the river and swam across, but the second volley brought them all down.
After cutting out their kidney fat, they took as much of the carcases as they could well carry on their return route, and having mustered their forces at the camp where they had captured the old men and children, they despatched them also, and then commenced their retreat. When they reached the first station on the Western Port side of the mountains, they still had portions of the legs and thighs of their enemies, which they had not consumed, but reserved for those of the tribe who were not present. Many maintain that the aborigines are not cannibals. They are not cannibals for the love of human flesh, but there are occasions when they do eat their enemies, as in the present instance, where they did it to render, according to their notions, the deed of retaliation more complete, and under an impression that partaking of the flesh of an enemy tended to confirm hatredand foster a passion for fresh deeds of vengeance. (P.4, Bacchus Marsh Express, 26-3-1904.)
To be completed as time allows.
CAN PARISH MAPS BE WRONG? OH YES THEY CAN.
Anyone can make a mistake and copyists in the Lands Department could be excused for accidentally writing 297 instead of 279 when there is so much,often microscopic, detail to copy. That's what seems to have happened to crown allotment 4,section 3, parish of Kangerong, Robert Caldwell's "Dromana Hill",later known as Fairy Vineyard.
POSTSCRIPT. Boundary dimensions were given in links(hundredths of a chain or 20.1168 centimetres) and were written in almost microscopic numerals.These would have been clear enough on original paper maps unless a copyist had slightly smudged them, but in a photocopy of a photocopy the number of links seems to be different every time you look at it or change the angle of the magnifying glass. I have stated below that the southern boundary of crown allotment 4, section 3, Kangerong was 2258 links,but the online map showed that it was 3500 links. As a result the area of this allotment is probably correct.
The following was originally written in an email about Tar Barrel Corner but is deemed to warrant a journal.
I called in on Keith Holmes while I was at Bentons Square and in the short time available before he headed off to get laser treatment on his eyes, I showed him the comments under my post 1940 and Back To journal re the date and venue because he had not yet been contacted about it. Seems very keen and was looking forward to reading the three Cleine comments with his newly lasered eyes after his appointment.
I thought I had read that Keith's wife, Shirley,was a McIlroy*,so I checked and found that she was a Burston. Keith answered in the affirmative when I asked if she was related to George Burston and added that George had a house in Dromana.
*I had read it, not in a dream or Hill 'n' Ridge as I had thought but in an email about the location of some former hill and ridge residents and I quote:
Back again xxx,
Just a few thoughts that I hope may be helpful. I think that Keith Holmes wife Shirley may have been a McIlroy, but not sure.
I am sure that Hec Hanson mentioned the Burstons in MEMOIRS OF A LARRIKIN. (There's an index at the end.)
In the Shire of Flinders rate record of 1919- 1920, George Burston of Fitzroy was assessed on land in the central riding as follows:
189 acres part c/a 4, s(section) 3K (Kangerong); 80 acres c/a 25 c W (Wannaeue); 440 acres c/a 28A and 28B.
In the West Riding, George was assessed on:
268 acres part c/a 1, 2, section B,W. and 100 acres part c/a 2, section B, W.
Description of George Burston's land.
In 1919-20,George had apparently not yet bought his house in Dromana. In 1875, the rate record of the newly formed shire of Flinders and Kangerong consisted of about 10 pages at the most but by 1919 many farms had been subdivided and Dromana (town) residents were listed on pages 102 to 112 with the Kangerong Estate on page 113 and central riding farms from page 114 to 134 where the Dromana Estate started.
CROWN ALLOTMENT 4, SECTION 3, KANGERONG (Melway 159 J-K 9-12.189 acres part c/a 4, s(section)3 K.)
Consisting of 297 acres 2 roods and 29 perches, this was granted to Robert Caldwell (after whom Caldwell Rd was named) who also received the grant to crown allotment 10B.
Crown allotment 4 was bounded on the west by the wedge shaped town common, cum gravel reserve, (which ran from a spot over Boundary Rd from Jetty Rd to Arthurs Seat Rd. The remaining vestige of the wedge shape of this reserved land, now part of Arthurs Seat State Park, can be seen in Melway 159 H-J 11-12 . The width and southern extent of c/a 4 was exactly that of the quarry property shaded grey. The c/a 6 grants of "Simon the Belgian" as Colin McLear put it,(H.B.Simon, after whom Simon's Cutting was named) fronted the road reserve south of the quarry land.
Crown allotment 4 also contained the streets east of Hillview Quarry Rd to about 205 Boundary Rd. This estate was possibly subdivided by Dromana's whirlwind Progress Association president, Spencer Jackson, ,judging by the name of Jacksons Way, after his sales of the Foreshore Estate (on Lou Carrigg's former Racecourse and footy ground land behind the Dromana Hotel) and the Panorama Estate (where streets names indicated a view of Mt Macedon and the You Yangs) in 1927.
Which portion of c/a 4 did George own or occupy. Its Boundary Rd frontage was 4000 links(half a mile or 800 metres but because of the wedge shape of the gravel reserve,the southern boundary was 2258 links*.The depth of c/a 4 was 8100 links. The depth of the estate is 35 chains (3500 links) and the boundary between the estate and the grey quarry land is 39 chains. The depth of the estate (3500 links) multiplied by its mean width (3950 links) gives a result of 136.5 acres.
(*As stated in the POSTSCRIPT above, the southern boundary was 3500 links, not 2258 so the surveyor's very complicated calculation of crown allotment 3 is probably very close to the mark. Alterationsin thecalculation are in bold type.
The quarry land has a mean depth of 4650 links (half of the sum of 4500 links and 4800 links) and a mean width of 3700 links (half of the sum of 3900+ 3500). Length by width gives a result of 172 acres. If we add these two calculated areas, there is a total of 308 acres, about 10 acres MORE than stated on the parish map..*
However it is clear that George had land in both present portions of crown allotment 4. Were the streets named after counties and Anne named because of George Burston, Spencer Jackson or some later owner?
* It is possible that the surveyor wrongly calculated the area of crown allotment 4 (called Dromana Hill by Robert Caldwell and Fairy Vineyard by coachbuilders Elliot and Stevenson). The town common and c/a 4 form a rectangle adjoining the east boundary of "Gracefield" (Bryan's Cutting.) The northern boundary was 6 chains (the common) plus 40 chains ("Dromana Hill") making a total of 46 chains. The depth was fairly constant at 81 chains. This gives an area of 372.6 acres.
As stated, the combined calculated area of the town common and Dromana Hill was 372.6 acres. The online map describes the town common as crown allotment 4A but does not give its acreage. Relying on my paper map is risky but it does seem to describe the gravel reserve as consisting of 91 acres and two roods. If we deduct this from the combined 372.6 acres, the acreage of Dromana Hill would seem to be 281.1 acres, fairly close to the total of the housing estate and Hillview Quarry land (279.7 acres) and far short of the 297 acres on the parish map.
CROWN ALLOTMENT 25c WANNAEUE.(80 acres c/a 25 c W .)
This (sort of)triangular allotment, consisting of 79a. 2r. 16p, was granted to the Freehold, Investment and Banking Company of Aust. on 25-6-1905. Across Purves Rd from Seawinds and fronting Arthurs Seat Rd.,it is indicated by Melway 171 F-G1 and some of F2.
CROWN ALLOTMENTS 28a AND 28b, WANNAEUE. (440 acres c/a 28A and 28B.)
GET TO BED!
COMING IN APRIL, 2015.
Vin Jervis is writing his life story. There is a Vin Jervis Reserve in Melway 16 D11 between Kerferd St and Royal Avenue named after Vin,his dad and his son,who all bore the same name; the name of the reserve is not shown on Melway. Vin played footy for a club (name forgotten by me, Lincoln Stars?) that shared Ormond Park (Melway 29 A8-9)with Moonee Valley Football Club and later changed its name to Ascot Vale Presbyterians (playing at Fairbairn Park), later Tullamarine-Ascot Vale Presbyterians (playing at Tullamarine, and the seniors a few seasons back at Fairbairn Park)before merging with Essendon Baptists-St Johns,as Tulla-E.B.S.J. and then Tulla,with Ted Jennings as President, to set an Essendon District Football League record of five consecutive A Grade premierships.
Vin's book is going to be a very long one. I struck up a conversation with him on the way home from posting the DESPERATELY SEEKING notice about the 22-3-2015 BACK TO RED HILL. It started with Vin's long connection with the Mornington Peninsula. We chatted for ages. He had a butcher shop on the Boneo Rd corner near the Burnhams and when I mentioned Steve Burnham's website,he recommended (?) Archer's website about Sorrento. He knew Colin Campbell, who designed the McDonald golf course between Rye Township and his own golf course at Melway 168 A 5-6, on which Colin lived. I will not mention here the time Vin told Lou Richards, who interrupted a conversation between Vin, Colin Campbell and Greg Norman at the opening of the (? )Golf Course, to nick off.(Oops,I did!)
Vin owned land near Cape Schanck near Maralooba,the property of Ray and Charlie Cairns.He had land at Blairgowrie after the Wilsons had transferred their abbatoir to Shergolds Lane near Dromana. We chatted about Archie Revell at Rye, whose car drove itself home from the pub according to Dot Houghton. (Correction: it was Harold Revell and his dog drove the car! See Comment 1.)
At the moment,my focus is on the BACK TO RED HILL and Natalie's Hume Leader article about the Alec Rasmussen memorial plaque at Tullamarine Reserve (where I played for Tulla-Ascot Pres. in 1971), but at the end of March, Vin and I will continue his story (with a voice recorder because I could never keep up writing notes.)
The funny thing is that I'd had Vin's phone number in my list of history contacts for at least a couple of years but had never had the time to contact him. Having been looking for Red Hill contacts recently, as soon as he told me his name,I had a mental image of an intricately framed name and phone number in my notebook. Somebody had obviously said, "You've got to talk to Vin Jervis," and given me his phone number.
THIS IS GOING TO BE A CORKER!
Collection Holder Interviews - John Nieuwesteeg (Garden ...
R. "Mrs. Maude Alston" was renamed to R. "Mrs. Alston's Rose" after Tid Alston informed us that had Alister named* the rose, he would have called it "Mrs. Tom Alston" and not "Mrs. Maude Alston" (reflecting protocols of his time). From Alston's came R. "Mrs. Harold Alston", a climber with flowers, much like R. "Sunny South" but with more petals and a bit larger. R. "Countess of Stradbroke" came from Tom Garnett's Garden of St. Erth in Blackwood, Victoria.
*This rose must have been developed shortly before Alister's death. It seems to have been named in 1938 (see foot of journal.)
N.B.The above article claims that Alister Clark had been a neighbour of the Alstons. This indicates that section 10, Bulla Bulla (now occupied by Balbethan- Melway 384 K11- and a quarry) and named Dunalister by Walter Clark after his son,Alister, had not been sold as part of the Glenara Estate, confirming a claim made in a City of Hume heritage Study (titled Balbethan,I think.) However the property was obviously occupied by others,according to the study. Thomas Alston, whose wife was obviously Maude, owned 1000 acres including the 640 acre Oaklands (Melway 385 B9) between Dunalister and Craigieburn Rd; the remaining 360 acres was probably to the east in the parish of Yuroke. Another rose was probably named after members of another local family,the Guthries, who were pioneers near Arundel Rd, Tullamarine then near Emu Creek and the Sunbury-Lancefield road.
Alister Clark fell in love with flowers as a youth when attending the Chelsea Flower Show in London. After he inherited Glenara near Bulla Village he planted roses galore and with the help of his gardener, William Peers, developed and nurtured many new strains of roses (and I think,daffodils as well.
In a recent issue of The Blackwood Times, Blackwood historian,Margot Hitchcock, wrote an article about Matthew Rogers, the first or early owner of the land on which the Garden of St Erth was developed. Matthew, whose huge angel-topped monument is easily the most prominent in the Blackwood cemetery, was born in St Erth, Cornwall.
The same issue (and article?),probably Oct-Nov 2014,discussed the Garnett family's tenure at the Garden of St Erth.
The following website unfortunately does not indicate when the Diggers' Club was established but informs readers that weddings cannot be conducted at the the Club's other base.
St Erth - The Diggers Club
A wonderful garden featuring fruit trees, an espalier orchard, heirloom vegetables , perennials, daffodils, ... History. In 1854 Matthew Rogers, a Cornish stonemason, left Sydney in pursuit of gold discovered near Mount Blackwood in Victoria.
Weddings at St Erth
Enjoy the tranquil surrounds of the beautiful Garden of St Erth for a wedding to remember. Select your back-drop from our garden settings or historic St Erth cottage. Begin your day in a picturesque garden setting for your ceremony and photography. Follow with some light canapÃ©s and drinks in the garden surrounds and complete your occasion with a lovely reception in our new function room. Our menus utilise seasonal, regional produce from our gardens and the region.
Please note that we are not able to hold wedding functions at Heronswood in Dromana.
Margot Hitchcock will now be able to boast that Blackwood has contributed to the Alister Clark Rose Garden at Bulla! A small world isn't it! Another gem for Margot is that Tom Garnett had been writing a history of Alister and his roses.This is also from the interviews website at the start of the journal.
JOHN: Well, the revival of interest in Australia of Alister Clark ("AC") Roses started for me with Tom Garnett, a former patron of the GPCAA, who sadly passed away on the 22nd September, 2006. Tom was writing the book "Man of Roses - Alister Clark of Glenara and his family" and he suggested to Susan Irvine that somebody should hunt up and collect the Alister Clark Roses, saying that he was too old and she was not! Tom Garnett had been invited by Lady Johnstone to write a book on the life of her uncle, Alister Clark of Glenara. The book had been suggested to her in 1982 by Neil Robertson who was a bookseller at that time. Susan Irvine went to see Mrs. Eve Murray of "Langley Vale" in Kyneton, Miss Tid Alston of "Oaklands" at Oaklands Junction (the Alstons were neighbours of AC) and she also went to Glenara, AC's old property in Bulla, Victoria. From these three properties, Susan started the original Alister Clark Rose Collection... this must have been around 1983. As none of the roses at "Glenara" were named, a lot of mistakes were made! In the summer of 1986-1987 Susan Irvine asked me if I would be interested in budding and grafting a number of the Clark varieties - they were:
R. "Baxter Beauty" (Apricot sport of R. "Lorraine Lee")
R. "Borderer" (P. cop.amb., Poly. 1918, Everbl.)
R. "Cherub" (Salmon P. HT 1923, Cl.)
R. "Daydream" (Blush P, 1924, Cl.)
R. "Diana Allen" (P. 1939 Dwarf, Bed)
R. "Doris Downes" (P. HT 1932, Hedge)
R. "Ella Guthrie" (P. HT 1937, Scent. Everbl.)
R. "Glenara" (Rosy-P. 1952),
R. "Jessie Clark" (P. Single, Cl. 1915 Early)
R. âKitty Kininmonthâ (Carmine rose, HT 1922, Early cl.)
R. "Lady Huntingfield" (Golden, HT 1937, Everbl.)
R. "Marjorie Palmer" (Rose, 1936, Everbl.)
R. "Mrs. Maud Alston", R. "Restless" (Red, 1938)
R. "Ringlet" (P. white centre, 1922)
R. "Sunny South" (P. 1918, Everbl. Hedge)
R. "A.C. Cream",
R. "Pink Flori"
R. "Super Pink" (not the real names for the last three).
TOGETHER AGAIN in DESPERATELY SEEKING, SUNDAY HERALD SUN, p.76,11-1-2015.
A reunion of the Daniel family will be held at the Sherwood* (sic) Hunt Club in Bulla on SUNDAY, MARCH 22,(2015) FROM 11-3 P.M. Contact Trevor Parton at email@example.com for further details.
*"Sherwood" was part of a run apparently leased by Major Firebrace and part of Section 3,parish of Bulla,granted to Tulip Wright and subdivided as the gold rush got into full swing. In 1888,the Oaklands Hunt Club was formed but it was many years before it had its present headquarters,the late Dr Dickinson's SHERWOOD*. Much of the club's history revolved around the Daniel family, as is well and truly shown in D.F.Cameron-Kennedy's THE OAKLANDS HUNT. Don't be surprised to see photos of at least two of the Daniel men displayed in the clubrooms at Sherwood,the headquarters of the OAKLANDS Hunt Club. The Oaklands Hunt Club is situated in Melway 178 C6, its eastern boundary being that of the parishes of Bulla and Yuroke.
*A trove search for DICKINSON, SHERWOOD, BULLA shows that the original article about the farm was reprinted in countless country papers.
As my journal about John Cosgrave shows,Mary Daniel and her family were among the early pioneers of the future Bulla Road District. It must be nearly 25 years since I read the Daniel family history and it would be nice to think that this will be reprinted,perhaps with updates. One other thing I would like to see is the renaming of Daniels Rd to Daniel Rd so that it correctly recalls the surname of this pioneering family. (Otherwise Daniel may be thought to be a spelling mistake and that there was some sort of relationship to the pioneering DANIELS family of Keilor.) If a petition to this effect was signed at the reunion, I will be pleased to see that it is presented to Hume Council with the backing of the Broadmeadows Historical Society. If Trevor needs help to prepare arguments to support the request, I will be only an email away.
I can't remember how and when Mary became a widow but she was quite capable of fending for herself and her youngsters. Narbonne's orchard was well known but as an amusing story in the family history relates,the ground was prepared by unpaid labourers. Mary's boys? No! But relatives and friends who all carried the label "New Chums". These new chums had an enormous advantage in that they could avoid the inflated cost of the little-remaining and shoddy accommodation in Melbourne while they prepared for their journey to the diggings by staying at Narbonne. Cunning Mary explained that digging for gold was hard work and it would be wise to develop muscles and pick and shovel skills on Narbonne ground before venturing into the unknown.
Like John Pascoe Fawkner's mother, Mary valued the importance of an education and her descendants reaped the benefits, two working as municipal administrators at Bulla, with stone bridge-building being another accomplishment. Young Oswald Daniel displayed his pride in the history of Bulla while modestly giving the Daniel family rarely a mention (unlike D.F.Cameron Kennedy!) Oswald's history is included below. "Daniell" and the version of Firebrace* would seem to be typesetting errors rather than Oswald's but it is possible that Cosgrove for Cosgrave was the boy's boo boo. Anyone wishing to copy and paste the article should do so from the DANIEL entry in my DICTIONARY HISTORY OF BULLA journal,where lines have been put into A4 length AND MISSED ERRORS CORRECTED.
(*Part of Pascoe Vale Rd in the Essendon and Hawstead map was called Firebrace St.)
HISTORY OF BULLA.
Bulla derives its name from the abor-
iginal words, 'Bulla-Bulla,' which
mean 'two round low hills,' or 'the
two breasts.' I do not know who gave
the district that name, but it must have
been named in the early settlement of
Two of the earliest settlers of the
district were Mr Martin Batey (of Red
Stone Hill), and Mr George Evans
(father of Mr R. C. Evans, of Emu
Bottom, near Sunbury), who, with their
wives, landed in Melbourne from Tas-
mania before John Fawkner. (Evans was on Fawkner's Enterprize but Fawkner was ordered off at Queenstown to settle his affairs, not because of sea-sickness, and had to appoint Captain Lancey as leader. THE LIFE AND TIMES OF JOHN PASCOE FAWKNER, C.P.Billot.)
When these pioneers essayed their
eventful trip across Bass Strait the
weather was so rough they had to turn
back for shelter, when Fawkner decided
that he would not go on, and the first
trip was accomplished without him ;
and he did not come over till the second
Mrs Batey was sixteen years of age,
and Mrs Evans a year younger.
Other settlers were :âMessrs Page
Brothers, ??, Cognall (COGHILL), Fawkner, Duncan, Grant,
M'Nab, Riddell, Loeman, Dickens,
Hunter, and Greene.
Woodlands was the residence of Mr
Greene, who was a naval officer and re-
ceived this section of ground as a free
grant for services to the Crown.
The sections running northward are
now occupied by the Oaklands Hunt
Club, Messrs Peters, Quinlan, and
Anderson ; there were also grants from
the Crown to Major Fairbrache, Captain
Taylor, and other military officers.
The first church (the present Church
of England), which stands on a corner
of Woodlands, was built by Mrs Greene,
and a right of passage existed until re-
cently for persons attending church to
walk along the southern boundary of
One of Mr Greene's sons (Rawden)
died of thirst while travelling with
stock in Queensland, but his name is
perpetuated in the township of Bullaâ
the street near the Roman Catholic
Church being named 'Rawden,' and the
street on which the Shire hall stands
â'Greene' street. (Wrongly written as Green St for years and now named as Somerton Rd.)
The section extending from Mus-
grove's corner to the late Andrew
Carroll's was owned by Mr William
Wright, who cut it up and sold it about
the year 1852. Messrs Musgrove,
Johnson, Daniell, Carroll, Tulloch and
Waylett were among the original pur-
chasers. Mrs Mary Daniell purchased
two blocks of the estate, one of which is
still held by her grandson, Mr A. F.
The adjoining block she sold to the
late John Cosgrove, who was alderman
and first treasurer of the City of Mel-
bourne. Mr Cosgrave used to cycle out
on a 'bone shaker,' (a term given to a
certain make of early cycles) that must
have had an earlier history than the
famous machine of the late Professor
Kernot, and in his trips from North
Melbourne to the farm he used to arrive
with such an enormous appetite that
one of his standing boasts was that he
could eat anything that was put before
him, On one occasion a crow was pre-
pared, and he was invited to have a
meal of crow. After he had finished
the meal he remarked : 'Humph ! I
can eat crow, but I don't hanker
Mr Cosgrove afterwards sold to
Messrs Hunt and Standen. Mrs T.
H. Dean, of Moonee Ponds (a daughter
of Mr Standen) next possessed the
property ; then her son, Melbourne ;
and it has now become the property of
the Hunt Club.(SEE COSGRAVE JOURNAL RE DANIEL OCCUPANCY& KENNELS.)
It is a coincidence that the first run
of the Oaklands Hunt Club, in which
Mr H. H, Daniel carried the drag,
finished upon the very spot where the
kennels are now built.
Mr William Wright built an hotel,
which was named the' Bridge Inn,' on
the Deep Creek, but it is now a ruin.
He was known as ' Tulip' Wright. The
name was supposed to have been given
him when he was chief constable of
Port Phillip, but, as he had a beauti-
ful garden, and a fine collection of tulips
âin which he took a great pride, it is
more probable the name arose from the
For many years in the early days of
the district, there was no cemetery at
Bulla, and a considerable number of
those who died were buried on the bank
of the creek about Bulla bridge ; but in
1863 a grant was obtained from the
Government of a piece of land near the
Oaklands road, which is now used for
About the year 1842 the late Mr
Michael Loeman came up from Moonee
Ponds and took up the land which he
named ' Glenloeman.' On his second
trip he brought up the late Mr John
Dickins, who also look up land next to
him. Mr Loeman married a Miss
Isabella M'Lean, who was escorted in a
long overland journey from New South
Wales by the late John Dean, when the
New South Wales blacks had become
so dangerous that the white settlers
had to leave. Although Mr Loeman
was one of the very early settlers, when
he paid his first visit to Bulla a well
known identity, the late William Pen-
der (or ' Old Bill Pender' as he was
popularly known) was camped in a tent
on the edge of the creek just above
'Glenloeman' on land now occupied by
Mr James Allen. During the drought
of 1868 Mr Richard Brodie, of Helens-
ville, gave Mr Pender the remainder of
his sheep, which were in the last stages
of starvation, on condition that he took
them away, so that he could not see
them die A couple of days-after Mr
Pender left rain came and left Mr Pen-
der with a fine flock. He used to run
his stock along the roads between Bulla
and Lancefield, which was known as
Messrs Hume and Hovell, in their
first overland journey, must have crossed
the Deep Creek near Bulla, as the spot
where it is considered they crossed
Jackson's Creek is close to Mr A.
Randall's, in Tullamarine Island.
In 1860 the Burke and Wills ex-
pedition passed through Bulla, their
second camp being at a small water-
hole, traces of which are to be seen be-
hind the gorse bushes opposite the In-
verness Hotel, which was then kept by
A meeting was called on 23rd Octo-
ber, 1862, at the Bridge Inn for the
purpose of forming a Road Board Dis-
trict. Mr James Macintosh was in the
chair. The first Council was formed
and elected by a show of hands at the
meeting ; it consisted of Messrs Walter
Clark, Michael Loeman, Martin Batey,
James Macintosh, William Bethell,
Thomas Branigan, David Patulla,
Dugald Stewart, and John Dickins.
Mr James Macintosh was appointed
first chairman and Mr Walter Clark
occupied the chair the following year.
Mr Macintosh went to New Zealand,
where he took a prominent part in polit-
ics, and was Minister of Lands when
At that time the Bulla Road District
extended towards Melbourne as far as
Woods' Hotel, and the first ratepayers'
roll was revised at the Moone Ponds
Police Court, and signed by Messrs R.
McCracken, T. Napier, and M. Loeman.
After holding two or three meetings
at the Bridge Inn Mr Frost wanted to
charge the Council for the use of the room and Mr Melville of the Inverness
came to the rescue, and allowed the
council to have a room free of charge.
After holding their meetings for five
years in the places mentioned, the Coun-
cil built the present Shire hall, in which
they held their first meeting on 20th
The Bulla district was the first in the
colony in which wheat was grown. Mr
Maurice M'Auliffe, of Wildwood, gives
interesting accounts of the farmers is
the early 'fifties carting their wheat in
to Melbourne to Gillespie's mills, and
bringing home their supplies of flour.
Mr William Hunter also had a mill on
the creek, just above Bulla, the ruins of
which are still to be seen. The late Mr
Donald Ross was one of the masons
employed in the building of it.
The first school in Bulla was built on
a piece of land which had been granted
to the Church of England, about one
hundred yards north of Bulla Bridge,
and had for the first teachers the
Misses Thorpe. Miss Dickins, Messrs
P. Loeman, E. Fanning, and J. Lawlor
were among their pupils.
This school did service from 1854 til
1870, when the present school was built.
The opening of the new school was cele-
brated by a grand ball, which was held
in a marquee opposite the Shire hall,
and a special treat given to the children
by the late Richard Brodie, of Helens-
In the early days of the district there
used to be a boiling-down works on
Glenara, just above old Glencairn dam,
and about 1867 a pottery works was
started by the Victorian Pottery Com-
pany alongside the kaolin deposit at
These, with the flour mill referred to,
were the only manufactories established
in the district, and have long ceased to
Since the year 1870 the district has
simply been a farming one. With little
change or alteration, and very little
history can be recorded for these years.
The Oaklands Hunt Club was started
in 1888, Mr A. M'Dougall being the
The first show of the Bulla Horticul-
tural Society was held on lst May,
1897, Mr A. F. Daniel being presi-
dent, Mr E. Meeking secretary, and
Mr W. Peers* treasurer, and now com-
pletes its fourteenth year of existence
with this show,
(Age, 12 years 10 months). (P.2, Sunbury News, 4-6-1910.)
(*William Peers was Alister Clark's gardener on Glenara and deserves credit for his boss's fame as a breeder of Roses. According to Wally Mansfield,who lived on Roseleigh, adjoining Glenara, William Peers won Tatts and retired.)