jamo761 on Family Tree Circles
Journals and Posts
This is a journal entry about my Grandfather. I did not know him as he died before my parents were married. He has an interesting life, and like his mother whom I will write a separate journal for, had many marriages.If anyone has any further information about George or any of his wives, I would greatly appreciate your comments & information.
George Crompton Mansfield
Born: 14 Feb 1894 in Broughton, Salford, Manchester, England
Died: 3 Nov 1962 Hamilton, Waitako, New Zealand
George Crompton Mansfield was born in Pendleton, Lancashire, England to parents Lucy Dawson & George Crompton. Although baby George has the surname Mansfield, he is from what I can tell George Crompton's son. Lucy married three times (refer to journal for Lucy Dawson), the second time to Richard Mansfield. While I currently can not find a death for Richard Mansfield, the 1891 census Lucy is a widow with Joesph, Hugh & Richard Holt her sons. George was born in Salford in 1894, but Lucy didn't marry George Crompton until 1910, but in 1901 Lucy was living with George as his servant with her sons. I imagine that the church might have set up George and Lucy, although I haven't researched this further. My logic behind George Crompton being baby George's father even though no father is named on the birth record is that three children of Lucy's born 1894, 1896 and 1898 all have Crompton as a middle name used through out their life. Baby George has Crompton on his birth certificate, therefore I believe George Crompton, Lucy's employer in 1901, was more than just an employer. I believe George, Paul & Walter have Mansfield as a last name simply because Lucy was still a Mansfield and wasn't married to George.
1901 Census, George was living with his mother Lucy, George (his mother's employer and who I believe is his father). At 7 years the census documents George and his brothers as bleachers in the Dye Works, they didn't even go to school by the look of it.
1911 Census, George is living with his mother and George Crompton in 13 Dale St in Kearsley, Farnsworth, Bolton. He is 17 and working as a moulder for an Iron Foundry.
12 July 1913 George married Lily Riley. On their marriage certificate George is 21 and Lily is 20. I imagine considering I have George's birth certificate and he was definitely not 21, that he lied about his age because in August he enlisted in the Army. So at first I thought they married because of George's enlisting, but then I found their first child, Richard born in the last quarter of 1913. So I'd say they married so young because he was enlisting and because she was pregnant.
August 1913 George enlisted with the Army, Regimental Number: 1832. George joined the Territorial Force for 4 years, the Parish is St Thomas in Pendleton, which matches. There is another George Crompton Mansfield enlistment, but the Regimental Number is : 47305 and he is born approx 1893 in St John, Lancaster, England, while the name is the same and it's an unusal name, I'm not sure this the is the same George. This George enlisted on 23 Oct 1914 for a short service of 3 years to the Royal Garrison Artillery. But I can only find a single birth record for George Crompton Mansfield between 1892 and 1896, so it could be the same person.
Oct-Dec 1913 Richard Mansfield is born
7 Jan 1914 Richard was baptised at St Peter in Farnworth
Jan-Mar 1914 Richard dies
09 March 1914 Richard is buried, he lyes in the Farnworth Cemetery, Lancashire, England
Jan-Mar 1915 Marjorie Mansfield is born
I can not find a baptism record for Marjorie, maybe there wasn't enough time for her to be baptised.
Apr-Jun 1915 Marjorie Mansfield dies
08 Apr 1915 was buried, she lyes in the Farnworth Cemetery, Lancashire, England
It seems Lily had such a very hard start to her marriage with George.
1: Baptism - Was George Baptised or not
1: George Crompton Mansfield Birth Certificate - Recieved
2: Marriage to Lily Riley - Received
3: Milatary enlistment record
4: Marriage to Elizabeth Babb - Received
5: Passenger List for Voyage to New Zealand - found on line
6: Marriage to Alice Mary Elizabeth Mace - received
7: Birth Certificate of Wallace Alfred Mansfield- received
So this journal entry is a little off my family tree... well it's not on my direct line or my husband's but an interesting one anyway... This research started with my mother in law finding a grave stone of a James & Jane Ward and wondered if they were the parents of the husband of Thirza Jane Moon, who is the sister to Mary Ann Maria Moon. Mary is the Gt Gt Grandmother of my husband. So here is what I have found out about them...
James Wakeford Ward
Born: ? Jan 1810 in Bridport, Dorset, England
Died: 12 Jun 1881 New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
James Wakeford Ward was born in Bridport Dorset to parents John Ward & Ann Curme. As yet I have not found where the Wakeford name comes from. It is more than likely either of his Grandmother's madian names. But I'm yet to confirm this.
On the 31st Oct 1830 James married Jane Long. Although there are some historians have have James Ward marrying Jane Balson. Due to the lack of dates on these family trees, it is not easy to tell whether they have the same James Ward, or whether it is another one. But they do have the son of James Ward, Joseph marrying Thirza Jane Moon. So this assumes there is an issue with whom James Ward married.
Looking on Ancestry.com, James Wakeford Ward married Jane Long on 31st Oct 1830. Although there are many James Ward's marrying in the year 1830, only one has the middle name Wakeford. So this ties up in my opinion whom James married. I can not find a marriage record for a Ward & Jane Balson around the time of 1830. There is one in 1844, but James & Jane were already in New Zealand by then, so this would mean that this information is incorrect. I do believe there is some connection with the Balson family, as I found in the 1841 English census that an Ann Balson was either living with or visiting James & Jane. So it's likely there is a connection, but just not sure what yet.
But the next question begs, was James Wakeford Ward the father of Joseph that married Thirza Jane Moon. I believe this is correct as the baptism record has Joseph Curme son of James & Jane Wakeford Ward ... While Wakeford is not the madian or middle name of Jane it is for James. Therefore I believe this connection is correct.
Born: 04 Jul 1811 in Bridport, Dorset, England
Died: 14 Aug 1899 New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
Jane Long was born in Bridport, Dorset to mother Ann Long. In the christening record for Dorset, Jane is noted as a Bastard child. There is no father noted on the record. In 1826 Ann marries Joseph Balson. This is where the Balson name comes from. Although Jane keeps her mother's name through to her marriage to James. Ann Balson living/visiting Jane & James in 1841 is her mother.
Jane's mother Ann lived a very long time. She died at age 96, which in this age would have been very very old. Unfortunately her husband Joseph died in 1839 at age 42. So Ann spent 43 years without her husband an only 13 years with him. I'm unsure if they had any children.
James Wakeford Ward Family Time Line
1810 James Wakeford Ward was born on 10th Jan 1810 in Bridport, Dorset, England. Some historians have the date as the 3rd. I'm not sure yet which is correct.
1830 James married Jane Long (She was born on 04 Jul 1811 in Bridport, Dorset (Her parents were not married)) on the 31st October 1830 in Bridport, Dorset at the parish. (will need to determine which one). The two witnesses were Mary & Henry Curme. Henry & Mary are brother & sister, there parents are George Panchen Curme & Mary Fudge. I'm not sure yet how George fits in another thing to check into. (George Panchen CURME married Mary FUDGE 23 September 1800 Bridport Dorset, witnesses James SADLER, Mary HYATT and John CURME)
1834 Joseph Curme Ward is born in Bridport on 10 Sep 1834. Some historians have his birth in October, which with the baptism record does not match. There are two baptism/christening records, one for Dorset (14 Sep 1834) and one for England Christenings (11 Sep 1834). I wonder whether there is a transcription error for the England Christenings records, as I can not view the original. The Dorset record clearly shows the date as the 14th Sep 1834.
- Joseph (Joe) married Thirza Jane Moon on 13th May 1857 in New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
-- George John b 1857: d 1902 New Zealand
-- Henry b 1859 : d ? (could be 1929, but need to confirm)
-- Ada Sarah b 1862
-- Laura Jane b 1865
1837 John Curme Ward is born in Bridport in Jan 1837. Unfortunately he dies at age 4 on 4th May 1841 prior to the family moving to New Zealand.
1840 Ellen Ward is born in Bridport on 17 Jul 1840.
- Ellen marries John Kenyon in New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
1841 On the 2nd November 1841, James, Jane & two (Joseph & Ellen) children sailed from Plymouth, England on board the Timandra bound for New Plymouth, New Zealand.
1842 on the 24th Feburary 1842, James, Jane & Family arrive in New Plymouth ready to start a new life.
1844 Emily Ward is born on 10th Feb in New Plymouth.
1846 Annie Ward is born on 24th Oct in New Plymouth.
1848 Jane Ward is born on 23 Sep in New Plymouth.
1853 John Ward is born on 16 Feb in New Plymouth.
1856 Fanny Ward is born on 24 Jul in New Plymouth. Fanny died on 26 Sep 1879 at age 23 in New Plymouth.
1881 James died on 12th June 1881 in New Plymouth. He is buried at Te Hunui Cemetery in New Plymouth.
1899 Jane died on 14th Aug in New Plymouth at her son Joe's house. She is buried with James at Te Hunui Cemetery in New Plymouth.
2: Find out where the Wakeford name comes from
Ans: James's Grandmother is Mary Wakeford.
4: Find out how Henry & Mary are related to James.
They are cousin's on his mother's side.
5: Find evidence of James Wakeford Ward's actual birth date if it exists.
6: Add Joe & Thirza's children.
7: Add Ellen & John's children.
8: Add Emily's husband & Children.
9: Add Annie's husband & children
10: Add Jane's hudband & children
11: Add John's wife & children
12: Find out what Fanny died from. Also Fanny may have married Richard James Hoskin -Add children
13: Ann & Joseph Balson children?
Finally some work on my direct family line. James & Mary are my Gt Gt Grandparents.
Current Research Objectives:
1: Find all James & Mary Ann's children and their marriages
2: Alfred's wife Annie & Children, Hester, Emily and Annie came to Wellington, New Zealand on the boat the Corinthic in 1911, when did Alfred come to New Zealand.
3: Find out who the Annie was with Hester & Emily. She is not Emily and Hester's sister as she stayed in England with her family. My Nana remembers her, called her "Aunty Annie". How does she fit into the picture.
4: Information about James William FIELDEN and Mary Ann Speight JAMES
James William FIEDLEN
Born: 1850 in Saddleworth, Yorkshire, England
Died: 1907 in Macclesfield, Cheshire, England
James William Fielden born in Saddleworth, Yorkshire England to parents William FIELDEN and Nancy HALLIWELL. Haven't searched for an actual date yet, have been working on the children. Will do more research on these two once I have found the answers to my questions above. Refer below for information about James that I have found up till now. James' father William was noted as a Congregational Minister on his wedding certificate.
Residence: 22 Spring Head (Village), Saddleworth
William Fielding (spelt incorrectly) (34) b Tormoden, Yorkshire - Roller Coverer
Nancy (36) b Bradford, Yorkshire - Roller Coverer
Elizabeth Ellen (13) b Ashton, Lancashire - Cotton (?)
Samuel Halliwell (12) Ashton, Lancashire - Scholar
Emma (10) b Oldham, Lancashire - Nurse
Alice (3) b Saddleworth, Yorkshire
James William (1) b Saddleworth, Yorkshire
Residence: 3 Moss Lane, Altrincham, Cheshire
William Fielding (spelt incorrectly) (54) b Tormoden, Yorkshire - Independant Minsiter - Boardheath Chapel
Nancy (56) b Bradford, Yorkshire
Alice (23) b Saddleworth, Yorkshire - Dressmaker
James William (21) b Saddleworth, Yorkshire - Commerical Clerk
Mary Ann Speight JAMES
Born: 29 Aug 1844 in Bermondsey, Surrey, EnglandHave birth certificate
Baptised: 22 Sep 1844 at St Mary Magdalene, Bermondsey, Surrey, England
Died: 1890 in Altrincham, Cheshire, England
Mary Ann was born to parents William James and Jane Turner in Bermondsey, Surrey. William is noted as a W[?] Clerk on her birth certificate and a shipping clerk on Mary Ann & James' marriage certificate. Again I haven't done much research into this family yet either, concentrating on the children.
Currently can't find Mary Ann Speight James in the 1851 Census and the 1861 census is doubtful, although could be her. She isn't an easy person to find.
I believe this is Mary Ann, only due to the fact that she is living with Elizabeth Ellen Fielden, therefore it is feasible that Mary Ann met James through his sister Elizabeth. Although this Mary Ann says she was born in London. Really it is a guess.
Mary Ann James (26) b London, England - Milliner (Assistant) Address: 3 High Street.
20 March 1872 Marriage
Mary Ann & James married at the New Congregational Church, Bowdon Downs, Bowdon, Altrincham, Chester.
James is noted as living at 3 Moss Lane Altrincham, which matches with his 1871 census, but Mary Ann is noted as living at George Street, Altrincham, which doesn't match 1871 census of High Street.
Address: Hale Road, Hale, Altrincham, Cheshire
James W Fielding (again spelt incorrectly) (31) b Saddleworth, Yorkshire - Gray Cloth Salesman
Mary A (35) b London
Alfred W. H. (7) b 1874 Southport, Lancashire W is for William, H could be for Halliwell after his grandmother on his fathers side
Arnold L (6) b 1875 Altrincham, Cheshire unsure what the L stands for, and I'm not sure I agree with the Ancestry translation of L, the top loop looks like it is wrong for the L when looking at the same writer writing Lancashire, might be an I, but still no idea what it would stand for
Annie B (3) b 1878 Altrincham, Cheshire B is for Belmont, not sure where this comes from could be mother's side
Hester M (1) b 1880 Altrincham, Cheshire M is for Mary
1890 Mary Ann's death
Mary Ann dies between April & June 1890 in Altrincham, Cheshire. I can not find a probate record for her death. She left behind some very young children, Emily 6, Frank 8, Hester 10, Annie 12, Arnold 15 and Alfred 16
Address: Stockport Road, Altrincham, Cheshire
James W Fieldin (again spelt incorrectly although i could be an e) (41) b 1850 Saddleworth, Yorkshire - Gray Cloth Agent
Alfred W. (17) b 1874 Southport, Lancashire - Draper (Apprentice)
Arnold J (16) b 1875 Altrincham, Cheshire - Grocer's Assistent Now the initial is definitely a J, which makes sense as it would mostly likely be his mother's madien name James
Annie B (13) b 1878 Altrincham, Cheshire - Scholar
Hester M (11) b 1880 Altrincham, Cheshire - Scholar
Frank T (9) b - Scholar
Emily A (6) b - Scholar
Annie Fielden (36) Sister to James b Lees [?] Oldham, Lancashire It is very likely that Annie came to help out with the children after Mary Ann died.
James is out visiting at 35 Brompton Street, North Manchester, Lancaster
James W Fielding (spelt different again) (50) b Saddlworth Yorkshire - Estate Agent
None of the children are with him
1907 James' Death
James dies in 1907 in Macclesfield, Cheshire, England. Like his wife Mary Ann, I can not find a Probate record for his death.
CHILDREN of James William FIELDEN and Mary Ann Speight JAMES
Alfred William H FIEDLEN
Born: 1874 in Southport, Lancashire, England
Died: 24 Jun 1945 in New Zealand
Alfred William was born in Southport, Lancashire. The H I have not found an official document with his name on it, but I would assume it is his Grandmother's maiden name on his father's side (HALLIWELL). It is only referenced one other time apart from the name on this birth record online and that's the 1881 census. After this it is shortened to Alfred William Fielden.
Alfred marries Annie ROYLE in 1894 in Altrincham, Cheshire.
1901 Census Alfred's family is together in Northenden, Cheshire.
1911 Census Alfred's family is missing Alfred and Emily Ashworth Fielden (his sister) is staying with them. Alfred has not died, because I can find him in New Zealand.
1911 on board the Corinthic bound for Wellington New Zealand, Annie Fielden nee Royle, her four sons and at least two of her sister in laws, Emily Ashworth Fielden, Hester Mary Fielden and Annie Fielden. I am yet to identify Annie. Annie initially looks like she is a sister in law also, Annie Belmont Fielden. But Annie marries William Edward Goodwin in 1900. Refer to Annie Belmont below (when it's written) she dies in Cheshire. Therefore this is not Annie Belmont, Alfred's sister. The other person it could be is Alfred's Aunt Annie, James William's sister. Time for some more research.
I'm currently researching Joseph & Ann Matilda and have started with the following, will need to be updated with more information as it is received.
They are an interesting couple, related to me through my husband's family. Ann Matilda is a sister to Levi Sarten who is my husband's Gt Gt Grandfather. Many of the Sarten family are easy to track as they stayed in New Plymouth. Ann Matilda on the other hand is not.
ANN MATILDA SARTEN (1846-1887)
Ann Matilda Sarten, seventh child of Edmund Sarten & Lucy Rodd Lye b: 03 Nov 1846 at Currie Street, New Plymouth, New Zealand.
Ann married Joseph Hanley on 03 Sept 1863 at the St Mary's Church in New Plymouth, New Zealand. This is now confirmed as the same person as Joseph Cudd. Ann died with the surname Cudd in 1887.
TODO - Ann Matilda Sarten
1: Separate journal entry on Ann Matilda's parents Edmund & Lucy Sarten
2: Obtain Birth Certificate for Ann Matilda Sarten - confident I have details of birth correct
3: Obtain Marriage Certificate for Ann & Joseph - confident I have details correct
4: Obtain Death Certificate for Ann Cudd - confident I have details correct but need actual death date and location.
JOSEPH CUDD (1840-1880)
Said to be born in Dublin Ireland, but as yet I have no evidence to prove this and apparently there might not ever be evidence to prove it. Some family history researchers have Joseph as Joseph Hanley Cudd. This is incorrect. I have been advised that Joseph was born to parents Joseph Cudd (Birmingham) & Eleanor Dignam (likely Ireland). Joseph Snr died young 1852 and Eleanor married again to Patrick Hanley. This is where the surname Hanley comes in. It seems that Joseph started using Hanley as his surname instead of Cudd. I have have given the above information from a Cudd family member, but as yet I have not been given appropriate documents to
Joseph joining the British Army. Unknown when he enlisted, but he has an occupation in the 1871 Census (where he and Ann can be found in Devon with the surname Hanley) is with the 57th Regiment. This makes alot of sense as I can not currently find a record of Joseph coming to New Zealand on a ship. But the 57th Foot Regiment did come to New Zealand in 1860 via Ireland. So Joseph could have enlisted either in Ireland or in England. Most likely in England. There were three ships (Star Queen, Castilian & Prince Arthur) that brought the 57th Regiment to New Zealand leaving in November 1860 and arriving in New Zealand in January 1861, but only one (Star Queen) went from Auckland to New Plymouth to fight the Maori wars in Taranaki. It is on the Star Queen that I believe Joseph came to New Zealand on. While in New Zealand Joseph meet Ann and they married. In Feb 1867 an article in a paper advises that the 57th Regiment has been recalled back to England. It was not until September 1867 that they actually went. It is very likely that Ann went to England with Joseph, they had no children as the two (one confirmed, 2nd not yet) children had died as infants. In the 1871 census John Hanley (Joseph & Ann's son) is noted as being born at sea. This would make sense, as he would have been born on the boat back to England.
The name change from Hanley to Cudd may have been one to leave the past behind. It seems a Joseph Hanley was convited of Larceny and we sentenced in 1874. By this time he would have left the 57th Regiment as they had left for <input place> country. I can find one conviction that I believe is definitely this Joseph Hanley as he is in Devon, but the one in 1874 would be a guess. But it could be a fairly accurate one and a good reason to change his surname back to his actual birth name, as he would leave his record behind.
Joseph & family immigrated to New Zealand in 1875 on board the Mataura. One of the children died at sea. The record I found does not state which one, but I can not find a death record for John Cudd (eldest child) in New Zealand. He may have gone back to England/Ireland, I'll need to search school records to determine whether he actually arrived in New Zealand alive. Further investigation is required.
TODO - Joseph Cudd
1: Separate journal entry on Joseph's parents Joseph & Eleanor Cudd, including Eleanor's second husband whom had a last name Hanley
2: Obtain Birth record for Joseph Cudd - May not be any details of his birth
3: Obtain Death Certificate for Joseph Cudd - confident I have details correct but need actual death date and location.
4: Obtain enlistment record for Joseph into the British Army. This may have occurred in England or Ireland.
5: Obtain service record for Joseph if obtainable. Belonged to 57th Foot Regiment.
6: Obtain birth & marriage details for Joseph Cudd Snr
7: Obtain birth & 2nd marriage details for Eleanor Dignam (marriage to Patrick Hanley)
8: Research the names of the boats that sailed the 57th Regiment back to England in 1867
9: Research Joseph's live in New Zealand and add details
Joseph & Ann Matilda HANLEY/CUDD Family Time line
5 Sept 1865 Alice Letitia HANLEY was born in New Plymouth, New Zealand. She is noted in the NZ BDM site as Alice Letha HANLEY (record number 1865/3174 ) I do not have a birth certificate to confirm that Alice is actually a child of Ann & Joseph and there are no parents noted on the online record. The Sarten Family History book "The Sarten Story - Taranaki Pioneers" does have Alice as a child of Ann & Joseph HANLEY. The family history was reserched and the book printed in 1997. Alice is the only child noted in the book, and there is no birth or death records for Joseph only a birth year 1840, which is inline with what other researchers have. There are no other children noted in the Sarten Family book. I imagine this is because they moved to England.
5 Nov 1865 Alice Letitia died.
Sept 1867 Joseph & Ann sailed back to England with the 57th Regiment. They are still going under the name HANLEY.
1867 John HANLEY born at Sea, so must be after or during Sept 1867
1869 Emma Lucy HANLEY (1869/1924) born in Aldershot, Hampshire, England (Military) : Regiment 57th Foot ; year 1869 : Volume 1239 : page 42 : GRO Regimental Birth Indices
1871 George Edward HANLEY (1871/1925) born in Devonport, Devon, England
- married Margaret BOYLE in 1897 in New Zealand
- Children -- Ida Dorothy b 1898
-- Cecil Francis b 1899
-- George Edward b 1901
-- John William b 1903
-- Lillian May b 1906
- Died 1925 in New Zealand Age at death puts birth year in 1873, but not sure this is correct.
1871 English Census - Joseph, Ann, John, Emma L & George E HANLEY living in Devonport, Devon England.
Between 1871 & 1873 Joseph reverts back to his birth surname CUDD.
1873 Alice Maud CUDD (1873/1956) born in Birmingham, Warwickshire, England
- Married Amos Williamson on 27 Apr 1897 in Bell Block, New Plymouth, New Zealand
- Children -- Alice Williamson
-- Andrew Williamson
-- Ethel Williamson
-- James William Williamson
-- May Williamson
-- Walter Claud Williamson
-- Amos Edward Williamson
-- Charles Williamson
- Died 5 Dec 1956 in Opunake, Taranaki, New Zealand
20 Oct 1875 On board the Mataura from England Mrs Cudd is confined and a child has died. It does not say that a child of Joseph & Ann Cudd has died, but one assumes that because Mrs Cudd is confined that it was her child that has died. The name of the child is not known.
11 Nov 1875 Joseph, Ann, John (8), Emma (6), George (4) & Alice (1) arrived in New Plymouth on board the SS Taranaki after arriving in Nelson departed from Gravesend on 8th August 1875. Joseph is noted as a Ropemaker with Dublin next to occupation. unsure if this means he was born in Dublin or that is where he travelled from
5 Oct 1877 Daughter of Joseph Cudd still born - Devonport, Taranaki - article in Taranaki Herald. I can find no record on the NZ BDM website.
1879 William CUDD born in New Zealand
- died before 21 Nov 1883, as this was the date he was buried. He is buried at Te Hunui Cemetery, New Plymouth, New Zealand.
19 Feb 1880 Joseph CUDD Died at Colonial Hospital New Plymouth New Zealand of Heart Disease.
8 Nov 1880 Mrs Joseph CUDD has a narrow escape almost being hit by a train. I wonder whether this shows the start of her mental decline after loosing her husband so young. She also has a young baby boy, so there could be some post natal depression in there as well. All circumspectual of course.
19 Dec 1883 Ann is brought before the courts to determine if she is of sound mind. She is not eating and is apparently addicted to intemperance. I believe this may be because she lost her son William one month prior. She has 4 children ranging in age from 9 to 16. Which proves that John is still alive in 1883.
1887 Ann died in New Plymouth, New Zealand.
Any further information would be greatly appreciated to extend this part of the family tree
I'm looking for information on Lily Riley, born in Frodsham, Cheshire, England in 1893, could be 10 Dec 1892
I can find her with her parents Arthur & Emma Riley and with her siblings in 1901 and 1911. In 1913 she married George Crompton Mansfield, my grandfather. She had two children Richard b:1913 d:1914 and Marijorie b&d: 1915, both died before they were a year.
My grandfather enlisted, but after 1915 I don't know what happened to them. My Grandfather, I think ran away to Aston, Birmingham where he married a widow, Elizabeth Dorothy Babb in 1922.
But I can't find a death record for Lily between 1915 and 1922, so I can only assume that he illegally ran out on her. I can't imagine it was easy loosing two very young children, I thought Lily might have gone back to one of her sisters.
I can find a death for Lily Mansfield in 1973 in Farnworth, making her about 80 years old. I am currently waiting on the death certificate to verfiy whether it is my Lily or not.. Farnworth is where George left Lily, but I thought she might have gone back to where she grew up in Cheshire.
I would greatly appreciate any help anyone can provide.
Lucy is my Gt Grandmother, she is an interesting woman from my perspective as she married three men, and there is a question mark around the actual father of the last three. Below are my notes on her life...
Born: 1835 in Pendleton, Lancashire, England - Likely in the St Thomas Parish
Died: 3 Nov 1962 Hamilton, Waitako, New Zealand
Lucy was born to parents William Dawson & Alice unknown. They had five daughters from what I have found
- Elizabeth Hannah - b:1855 Pendleton, Salford, Lancashire, England
- Mary Ann - b: 1859 St Thomas' Salford, Lancashire, England Either died before 1871 Census or was at another house during the census.
- Lucy - b: 1861 Pendleton, Salford, Lancashire, England
- Sarah Ellen - b: 1864 Pendleton, Salford, Lancashire, England
- Hannah - b: 1869 Pendleton, Salford, Lancashire, England
William was a Weaver at the time of Elizabeth's baptism and later became an "overlooker" at the Cotton Mill in Salford in the 1871 Census.
Lucy married three times, first to William Holt, then to Richard Mansfield and finally to George Crompton.
Lucy Dawson Time Line
1871 England census - Lucy is living with her Mother & Sisters in Pendleton, Lancashire. William is not noted on the census, he could be elsewhere.
1879 Lucy has a child John Joseph Dawson. Unknown father.
1881 England Censes - Lucy is noted as unmarried, she is living with her mother Alice and has one child John J Dawson. The age on the record is incorrect, it says 19 for John Joseph, I suspect it's more like 19 months.
1881 Lucy marries William HOLT at St Simon's Church in Salford Lancashire. William could be the father of John Joseph, but considering they didn't get married just before or just after, one imagines he is not.
1883 Richard Holt is born in Pendleton, Lancashire.
- Richard married May Pearson in Salford, Lancashire in 1904
-- Lucy Holt b 1909
1885 Hugh Holt is born in Pendleton, Lancashire
1886 William Holt dies.
1887 Lucy Holt marries Richard Mansfield in Salford, Lancashire, England - She is a widow and marries Richard with the surname Holt.
1890 Richard Mansfield dies. The only record I can find for a Richard Mansfield's death is in 1890, and his age is 54. That would mean that Lucy married a 51 yr old, which seems a bit strange. I'll get the marriage Cert to confirm.
1891 England Censes - Lucy is noted as a widow, she has three children John J Holt, Richard Holt & Hugh Holt. She is living with George Crompton, but is not married to him.
1894 George Crompton Mansfield is born in Salford, Lancashire
- Death: 1962 Hamilton, Waikato, New Zealand
1896 Walter Mansfield is born in Salford, Lancashire
- Death 1956 in Salford, Lancashire, England
1898 Paul Crompton Mansfield is born in Salford, Lancashire
All three of the boys above have Mansfield as a surname and Crompton as part of their name throughout their lives. It would be unusual for a woman to name her children after an employer. It is therefore with this in mind that I believe they are George's children. Lucy marries George later in 19
Mary Agnes is my husband's Gt Gt Grandmother, and the following is information I have found with the help of ngairedith. I'm still looking for information, so if you have corrections or additions to this page, please add a comment to let me know.
Mary Agnes BLEASEL
Born: ~1856 in New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
Baptised: unknown if she was baptised or christened
Died: 06 July 1 1933 in New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
Buried: 08 July 1933 Te Henui Cemetery, New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
Mary Agnes was born to parents John Bleasel (also spelling Blesel, Blesil) & Elizabeth Cotter (could also be Cottier) in approximately 1956. Records conclude that she was born in New Plymouth, but at present I can not find a source document to prove this. It is likely that she was not registered. Mary's parents and the location of her death came from the funeral record obtained from W Abraham in New Plymouth.
Born: ~1820 in Lancahsire, England
Baptised: unknown if he was baptised or christened
Died: 09 Feb 1865 in Taranaki, New Zealand
Buried: unknown where he is buried
John Bleasel was a Gunner in the Royal Artillery, born about 1820 in Lancashire, England occording to 1851 Census record. It is likely that John was posted to Ireland where he met his wife to be. With their first daughter born in Cork, Ireland, I imagine they were married in Ireland, maybe Cork between 1838 & 1842. This is yet to be confirmed. Can not find John in the 1841 England cesus, it is likely that he is in Ireland. Also need to find his enlistment record to find out when he joined the Royal Artillery.
Born: ~1819 in Co Louth, Ireland
Baptised: unknown if she was baptised or christened
Died: 1883 in Taranaki, New Zealand
Buried: Te Hunui Cemetery, New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand
Elizabeth's maiden name could also be COTTIER, it is hard to read the writing on the funeral record for Mary Agnes.
In the 1851 Census he and his family were living at 51, Soldiers Cottages, Charlton, Greenwich, Kent
John Blesel married 31 1820 Gunner R Artillery Lancashire, England
Elizabeth Blesel married 32 1819 Co Louth, Ireland
Alice Blesel Daughter 9 1842 Cork, Ireland
Elizabeth Blesel Daughter 5 1846 Scholar New Brunswick, N A
James Blesel Son 3 1848 Frederick Toon N A
John Blesel Son 1 1850 Woolwich, Kent
John & his family came out to New Zealand likely in 1860. A War record shows he was in service in the Taranaki Wars between 1860 and 1864. Therefore my current theory (thanks to Ngairedith) is that he and & his family came to New Zealand on board a ship carrying Military personel. It is noted in the Encyclopedia of New Zealand, that British troops came to New Zealand as early as 1855, but the Taranaki Maori Wars didn't start till 1860. This could be why his record shows 1860 t0 1864 in Taranaki. The record also shows he was in the 3rd Bat 12 Bde, so not entirely sure which regiment he was in, maybe the 12th.
A military record has John passing away in Taranaki on 09 Feb 1865, there is no record on the online NZ BDM website to verify this.
I found a burial record for Elizabeth Bleasel in 1883, she is buried at Te Henui Cemetery. There is an NZ BDM record for her, will order death certificate in the future, hopefully this will provide her parents names.
Back to Mary Agnes
She married Atkinson Joseph Clarke in 1874 and they had the following children Assuming all children were born in New Plymouth, but this is just a guess
John Atkinson Clarke b 1877 d 1952
Michael Edward Charles Clarke b 1879 d 1955
Mary Elizabeth Ann Clarke b 1881 New Zealand
Edward Francis Clarke b 1883 d 1960
Archibald Bernard Clarke b 1884 New Zealand (My husband's Gt Grandfather)
Norah Clarke b 1886 New Zealand
Agnes Stella Clarke b 1889 New Zealand
Mary died on 06 July 1933 in New Plymouth, Taranaki, New Zealand.
Still looking for information about John BLEASEL & ELIZABETH COTTER, ie birth records, marriage records. I doubt the shipping passenger list will be available as they would have come into the country on a boat carrying military.
Well technically you could say it was my second... unfortunately I accidently clicked the wrong button, and all my typing and thoughts and nice blog entry went into the deep abiss and now I have to type it again... oh well, this will probably be shorter, but has the same main content.
My name is Megan Emily Jamieson (nee Mansfield) and I'm working on my Son's family tree. There are four branches
Mansfield - My paternal side
Mudgway - My maternal side
Jamieson - Rowan's (my husband) paternal side
Sarten - Rowan's maternal side
So I've been very lucky, on the Sarten side of the family, Rowan's mother (June) has been doing a lot of work on this tree, which has been very handly as I can piggy back off her research. Although she is more interested in the 1800 Sarten's and I've been working on the New Zealand Sarten's which is post 1840. Still once I complete the NZ Sarten's, there will be a lot of research I will be able to pull in from her tree. On the Jamieson side of the family, two people have been working on this. Rowan's cousin Julia and Rowan's second cousin once removed Scotty. So I have an excellent base for the Jamieson's. Unfortunately this usually means that I ignore the Jamieson's and the Sarten's as I know other's are working on it, but that's just the way things are.
I have the following goals
1: To create a living family tree. This will be a family tree of all the living Mudgway, Mansfield, Sarten & Jamiesons as a start. The course I've been doing reminds us that all too often we don't concentrate on the living first... once they are dead, they can't tell stories or provide you with informaiton. So I've emailed around my cousins, Rowan's cousins and I have a few more letters to write to obtain living family tree's.
2: I'll be working on each generation back from my son to ensure I have living and dead (sounds so morbid, but they are) relatives. working back on each generation, checking for siblings of my direct tree and expanding down to add living members to my tree.
3: To identify the boats that all my direct & indirect ancestors arrived in New Zealand on. This has already proved interesting as I have two returned serviceman in the family tree and they came to New Zealand on boats where I can not find passenger lists ... Usually says 123 soldiers. So I have had to make some assumptions, which has been interesting and informative.
Where am I at
1: Sent emails out waiting for information to be provided. Still need to send some letters, will endeavour to do that this week.
2: Need to finish 1: before moving onto 2. Although I do currently have almost a full 6 generation family tree completed. There are only 1 or 2 people left to find parents for, which is encouraging.
3: As I work on 2, I'll obtain the information that they came to New Zealand on. I have probably quarter of the ships now, so it's a matter of figuring out which ancestors I haven't got boats for and then manually searching through to find them.
Who am I currently working on:
[colour=grey]Birth: approx 1872 in Hokitika, West Coast, New Zealand[/color]
[colour=darkgreen]Marriage to Louis Mudgway: 01 Feburary 1892 at Registrar's Office in Wellington, New Zealand[/color]
[colour=brown]Death: 08 March 1930 in Tararu, Thames, Thames Valley, New Zealand[/color]
Mary Hawkins married Louis/Lewis Mudgway in 1892. They had 5 children, of which one is my mother's Grandfather. Lyndia's Lot has alot of information about the Mudgway's ... Although some of the information on this particular branch is incorrect, morely likely because original documents have not been obtained and information has come from verbal accounts and likely not verified.
Mary Mudgway died on 08th March 1930 in Tararu, Thames, not in Wellington. She was buried on 10th March in Te Aroha. The death certificate leaves a couple of things open, one the fact that the "age of widow if living" column is not populated with Louis/Lewis age when Mary died and most family tree's have Louis dying in 1954 as do I. So this is a bit confusing. Also an undertaker wrote out her death details, not Louis. If he was living, I would have expected him to fill it out. The second point is that on Louis & Mary's marriage certificate, Mary's mother's maiden name is Senior and I have found an NZBDM record for Annie Senior and James Hawkins, but the death certificate has her maiden name as Gerity. There are very fiew Gerity's in New Zealand at the time, and none that I can find around Hokitika. It could be that the undertaker has written down details from someone else's death on Mary's certificate or just that he has incorrect information. This may never be solved.
Next on the list of things to do for this particular couple:
1: Louis' Birth Certificate
2: Louis' Death Certificate
3: Verify children
4: Children's marriages & children if records allow.
5: Find a living relative and try and get information about living relatives in this part of the tree. There was a Mudgway family reunion about 10 years ago, so this may not be hard to obtain.
William MACE seems to be a common name around the 1800s, especially around the Dorset area, although there are a few around all of England. This particular William MACE is related to me on my father's side. William is my Gt Gt Grandfather's brother. My Gt Gt Grandfather was Septimus MACE also born Weymouth, Dorset, England.
Born: 1809 in Weymouth, Dorset, England
Baptised: 16 Apr 1809 in Weymouth, Dorset, England
Died: 1898 Shaftesbury, Dorset, England
Buried: 9 Feb 1898 Shaftesbury, Dorset, England
Born the middle child (4 of 7) to Edward MACE & Francis (Fanny) BEALE, he was born in Weymouth, Dorset, England. This is where he seems to have spent most of his life, like most people in this particular century. The great thing about these ancesters living in Dorset is that the Dorset records are particularly good on Ancestry.com, so I'm able to find actual baptism, marriage and burial dates. Which definitely helps with timelines.
Edward MACE (1778/1851) & Fanny BEALE (1780/1858) married on 22 Jan 1801 in the Melcombe Regis parish in Dorset. They had the following children which I have found.
-- Elizabeth Beale Mace (b 1801)
-- Paul Mace (b1802)
-- Edward Mace (1805/1887)
-- William Mace (1809/1898)
-- Frederick William Mace (1810/1890)
-- George Augustis Mace (1812/1901)
-- Septimus Mace (1814/1872) (my Gt Gt Grandfather) Family moved to New Zealand
One thing noticable for all the Mace's that I have death dates for, they lived long lives. Septimus died on a boat, so I wonder if he would have lived longer had there been better medical treatment available. Who knows.
Born: 1817 in Wyke Regis, Dorset, England
Baptised: 20 Jul 1817 in Wyke Regis, Dorset, England
Died: Jul 1850 Wyke Regis, Dorset, England
Buried: 12 Jul 1850 Wyke Regis, Dorset, England
Elizabeth was born to Parents Robert DUNFORD and Catherine PARSONS. They were married on 28 August 1816, both from the parish of Weymouth, they were married by BANNS in Wyke Regis, Dorset. Witness' were John Parsons & Ann Parsons.
William married Elizabeth Dunford on 19 Aug 1838 in Alton Pancras, Dorset. At the time of their wedding, William was a Watch Maker & Elizabeth had no profession. William's father Edward was a Gentleman and Elizabeth's father was a Master Mariner. The witnesses to their marriage were Sophia L??? and Jonathan POPLE. Unfortunately for William and Elizabeth their marriage would not make 15 years. Elizabeth died in 1850 from an unknown cause. Will need to get death certificate to see if reason is noted. She had just given birth to Jane Dunford MACE and considering how close the baptism of Jane and the burial of Elizabeth I would hazard a guess and say she died of complications from child birth.
William Mace Family Time Line
1809 William is born in Weymouth Dorset
1817 Elizabeth is born in Wyke Regis, Dorset
1838 Willam & Elizabeth are married
1839 Louisa MACE is born in Melcombe Regis, Dorset
- baptised on the 3 March 1839 in the Melcombe Regis parish in Dorset.
- William's occupation noted on Louisa's Dorset birth record is Watch maker
1840 William Frederik MACE is born in Melcombe Regis, Dorset
- baptised on the 10 Jun 1840 in the Melcombe Regis parish in Dorset.
- William's occupation noted on William Frederick's Dorset birth record is Watch maker
- William Frederick dies in 1904 in Thakeham, Sussex aged 64.
- Wiliam & his family are living in Spring Terrace, Wyke Regis Dorset
-- William, Elizabeth, Louisa & William
1850 Jane Dunford MACE is born in Melcombe Regis, Dorset
- baptised on the insert in the Melcombe Regis parish in Dorset.
- Jane Dunford Wightman died on the 3 April 1911 living at 26 High Street, Shaftesbury, Dorset. Her husband is noted as a gorcer in the probate record.
1850 Elizabeth dies leaving a very young family behind for William to care for. Jane Dunford is baptised just days after Elizabeth is buried. It may be that Elizabeth died in child birth.
- I can not find the Mace family in the 51 Census
- Louisa is a pauper living in a work house (Elizabeth Beale is also living in the work house, this may or may not be Louisa's Gt Grandmother on her fathers side)
- Jane is boarding at James & Sarah Parson's house. They have a daughter the same age, and they are part of the same parish that William & Elizabeth belonged too. It is quite likely they took Jane in when Elizabeth died as Sarah would have been feeding her daughter Elizabeth. I believe, but need to verify, James is likely a cousin of Elizabeth Dunsford, on her mother's side. Would need to view the 1851 census to confirm that Jane is at the Parson's just after being born.
16 Jun 1864 Louisa dies at the age of 25 and is buried on this date.
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